Do good levels really need BGO's

Socknic · Postby **Socknic** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 11:10 am

Honestly, I really haven't seen anyone too hung up on background objects. I enjoy levels which have great aesthetics, but I don't find that them to be more important than gameplay. I think what a level designer wants to do is find the perfect balance. You want fun, memorable gameplay blended with a great aesthetic feel. Sure, I wouldn't want to play a completely barren, boring wasteland of a level, even if it was well designed. However, on the other side of things, I'd rather not play the best looking level I've ever seen if it has terrible gameplay.

YouTube · Postby **bossedit8** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 11:31 am

Here is a specific Level that doesn't have any background objects in it:

Spoiler: show

and that idea was first announced in SMB3 itself so how is that bad by having without any background objects?

silent_ · Postby **silent_** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 12:20 pm

^

Still, it could use some waterfalls at the least.

YouTube · Postby **bossedit8** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 12:24 pm

Waterfalls aren't for me a necessarity for a Level like this. And what about this:

Nearly the same kind of style but with background objects.

Postby **DarkMatt** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 12:48 pm

Kep wrote:Still, it could use some waterfalls at the least.

Challenge: How do waterfalls contribute to the level? What makes waterfalls a necessity to be aesthetically pleasing to you?

silent_ · Postby **silent_** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:03 pm

DarkMatt wrote:
Kep wrote:Still, it could use some waterfalls at the least.
Challenge: How do waterfalls contribute to the level? What makes waterfalls a necessity to be aesthetically pleasing to you?

I think pronouncing "ass" would be an easier challenge than that.

Waterfalls are perfect for pipe mazes, because realistically, water comes out of pipes anyway. And they are aesthetically pleasing to me because it's nice to have some scenery/decoration/BGOs, and it's just nice to look at if you have some waterfalls because they're one extra thing that can give you five more points in the scenery section of reviews.

Radishl · Postby **Radishl** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:10 pm

Kep wrote:
DarkMatt wrote:
Kep wrote:Still, it could use some waterfalls at the least.
Challenge: How do waterfalls contribute to the level? What makes waterfalls a necessity to be aesthetically pleasing to you?
I think pronouncing "ass" would be an easier challenge than that.

Waterfalls are perfect for pipe mazes, because realistically, water comes out of pipes anyway. And they are aesthetically pleasing to me because it's nice to have some scenery/decoration/BGOs, and it's just nice to look at if you have some waterfalls because they're one extra thing that can give you five more points in the scenery section of reviews.

Should the pipes be empty and there's a drought, would Bossedit need to add waterfalls ?

Postby **DarkMatt** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:17 pm

Kep wrote:I think pronouncing "ass" would be an easier challenge than that.

Waterfalls are perfect for pipe mazes, because realistically, water comes out of pipes anyway. And they are aesthetically pleasing to me because it's nice to have some scenery/decoration/BGOs, and it's just nice to look at if you have some waterfalls because they're one extra thing that can give you five more points in the scenery section of reviews.

"Aesthetically pleasing to you" is called a pet peeve.

Oh and, just because you can justify it happening doesn't mean it has to happen.

I'm starting to understand the people who are pro-graphics are ESPECIALLY whores for waterfalls.

silent_ · Postby **silent_** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:39 pm

DarkMatt wrote:I'm starting to understand the people who are pro-graphics are ESPECIALLY whores for waterfalls.

That's like me going to a farm, petting a goat once for the first time ever, and one of my relatives saying "I'm starting to understand the people who are animal-lovers are ESPECIALLY whores for goats".

...Because I hardly ever use waterfalls, I only suggested that someone should ever use them once yet you're acting like I always talk about/use/suggest waterfalls, when I don't.

Postby **DarkMatt** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:41 pm

Then you're not one of the offenders.

I'm just drawing a conclusion considering my track record with playing levels with aesthetics and a good chunk of them have waterfalls in there somewhere.

Superiorstar · Postby **Superiorstar** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:51 pm

are you two seriously fighting over a freaking waterfall? it doesn't matter!
Anyways, here's a level with little to no bgos at all.

Do the aesthetics really matter with this level?

Postby **DarkMatt** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:53 pm

I'm saying that it does for some. It has to, why do I keep on seeing it used in everything ever?

I mean water's hot shit but come on.

Also that screenshot is really nice.

YouTube · Postby **bossedit8** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:54 pm

Similar to SMW but different Colors used. I like this and how is it bad to have nearly no background objects. I mean, back then, background objects are not much of a big deal so how is it completly (like, 100%) important now? Every undergrounds doesn't always have one aswell.

silent_ · Postby **silent_** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:58 pm

Superiorstar wrote:are you two seriously fighting over a freaking waterfall?

I actually guffawed.

Regarding your level's screenshot, it has enough BGOs to suit a SMW-styled snowland. However, if it had:

-no scenery as it is
-or was a SMB3-styled snowland with a visually appealing tileset

...I would tell you to add more BGOs. But, regardless of my buts, howevers, ifs and ands, it looks good.

Radishl · Postby **Radishl** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 2:02 pm

Kep wrote:
Superiorstar wrote:are you two seriously fighting over a freaking waterfall?
I actually guffawed.

Regarding your level's screenshot, it has enough BGOs to suit a SMW-styled snowland. However, if it had:

-no scenery as it is
-or was a SMB3-styled snowland with a visually appealing tileset

...I would tell you to add more BGOs. But, regardless of my buts, howevers, ifs and ands, it looks good.

It doesn't need more BGO's , the landscape is what it is now because the level designer made it like that. It however needs more elements like coin blocks and pipes.

YouTube · Postby **bossedit8** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 2:04 pm

Radishl wrote:It however needs more elements like coin blocks and pipes.

You can't add a lot of elements in one single screenshot. That stays. If you actually play the level by yourself you will see completly what the designer did put in.

Radishl · Postby **Radishl** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 2:04 pm

bossedit8 wrote:
Radishl wrote:It however needs more elements like coin blocks and pipes.
You can't add a lot of elements in one single screenshot. That stays. If you actually play the level by yourself you will see completly what the designer did put in.

I know but still, that one individual screenshot is barren.

Superiorstar · Postby **Superiorstar** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 2:07 pm

Radishl wrote:
bossedit8 wrote:
Radishl wrote:It however needs more elements like coin blocks and pipes.
You can't add a lot of elements in one single screenshot. That stays. If you actually play the level by yourself you will see completly what the designer did put in.
I know but still, that one individual screenshot is barren.

Don't worry, there are still pipes.
P.S. I'm not releasing this to the public.

Radishl · Postby **Radishl** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 2:09 pm

Superiorstar wrote: I know but still, that one individual screenshot is barren.

Don't worry, there are still pipes.
P.S. I'm not releasing this to the public.[/quote]
You should prob add a pipe or some coin blocks to tht screen.

silent_ · Postby **silent_** » Sat Aug 16, 2014 2:16 pm

I think someone can survive a screen without a pipe. Just sayin'. But, still, they're nice to have. I usually add one or two pipes with Piranhas and one or two pipes just for decoration each screen I take, just so I don't get criticized for "not having enough".