Using custom tilesets without replacing existing tilesets

[jaysparrow]

Problem! I want events to only happen once so I guess I need a script for that.
@devs
Really guys, sadly I'm ready to throw away all my levels and map and find a steam game with a level editor that is more user friendly then this.
Now with events I'm running into more fu*king problems and getting more headaches then its worth.
I am still sticking by with what I said before that this editor is not user friendly.
It's just on problem after another. Maybe you could add setting flags like you do on rpg maker so once you get an item then
a flag can be set so it won't appear again or I talk to an npc set a flag to collect an item then set a flag for them to say something different
after and not appear anymore, Of course it would have to be made simple so everyone could use it easy.
Setting flags for events in RPG maker 1 took some getting use to and was kinda easy for me after I did a few things but when they made RPG maker 2 and 3 they changed the way you do it and it got more complicated and it became unusable or me.

[Hoeloe]

The events system is very limited, and hasn't really been changed since SMBX 1.3. That's not the editor's fault, it's just how Redigit made events work. Generally if you want to do anything complex, you're looking at some basic scripting.

That said, you CAN do a lot with layers and events. For example, you can hook up an event to a powerup npc which toggles layers, swapping out one NPC for another, and allowing you to change their message.

[jaysparrow]

The events system is very limited, and hasn't really been changed since SMBX 1.3. That's not the editor's fault, it's just how Redigit made events work. Generally if you want to do anything complex, you're looking at some basic scripting.

That said, you CAN do a lot with layers and events. For example, you can hook up an event to a powerup npc which toggles layers, swapping out one NPC for another, and allowing you to change their message.

OK thanks, I will just have to try some things out I guess.
Is it possible on down the line for you devs. to change the event system to make it where its not so limited?
Hay I found this but not sure how or if I could use it for what I'm talking about.
Tutorials :: Super Mario Bros. X
CUSTOM NPC FLAGS
https://rpgmaker.net/tutorials/898/
Let me guess, this taking scripting skills doesn't it?
It would be neat if you could add flags on things in a simple way by a menu or something on the npc, block etc, properties or layers or events in some way.
A list of flags you could set like this with a check box.
No respawn yes no
Grab Top yes no
Grab Side yes no
Jump Hurt yes no
Invisible yes no
I guess if you were going to do something like that it would be way down the line for right now as you have other thing to fix.
Just a thought.

[Hoeloe]

That doesn't take any scripting, just a config file named "npc-#.txt". The tutorial you linked even explains how to do it.

[jaysparrow]

I tried to use an event to make toad move off screen and tried everything but nothing so I saved my levels and I'm moving on to something else until future versions when hopefully it will not be so limited and more user friendly.
For novice people wanting to use this editor to make cool stuff easily, this editor is not for you and is not recommended.

[Emral]

I tried to use an event to make toad move off screen and tried everything but nothing so I saved my levels and I'm moving on to something else until future versions when hopefully it will not be so limited and more user friendly.
For novice people wanting to use this editor to make cool stuff easily, this editor is not for you and is not recommended.

Most people you'll find around here learned using the engine with a worse editor when they were 10, so I don't think it's that easy to make such a sweeping statement. If you take a look around the content produced by the community before 2015, you will find that none of it used scripting or the current editor, because neither was available then. The content was also often extremely elaborate. So I don't think things are limited as much as you tend to make things harder for yourself at every corner. Something like making a toad walk offscreen requires the input locking event flags if you are toad and are the player (2nd to last drop-down in the event window i think), or hiding one toad layer and showing one where toad replaces a walking npc if toad is an npc (mix of the first drop-down in that window, and sprite replacements). It's all fairly simple.

[jaysparrow]

I'm not even talking about the scripting part now. The event system is limited and and has problems because lets say if I want a ? block to make
toad appear and when I talk to toad he disappears and makes and something else appear, well you are just shit out of luck because of the limited
selection with one each, current layer, destroyed, hit and layer is empty then for NPC'S you have current layer, attach to layer, activate, death, talk
and layer is empty so there is no way for me to link the three events together because of limited options in the proprieties.
It also hard because I have to guess how to place the the damn events in the proprieties just to get them to work.
This guy is right, the event system is complicated.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F4_ne1p0Ink

About toad: I was wanting to make it when you get a 1up he doesn't appear again so after I make him disappear by getting a 1 up it would move
him off screen which I couldn't get him to move. I tried not making him disappear and just move when I got the 1 up but nothing happened.
I wanted a one time event.
Because you are a dev. (which you know everything about this editor) you make it sound simple for everyone and that is just a false statement.
The 4 problems is:
1: The event system is limited.
2: The event system is complicated. (not user friendly)
3: The custom part of the editor. (not user friendly)
4: Scripting is required for some things. (not user friendly)

The rest of your editor if fine, it's just these 4 things.

Well I already moved on to something else and I still stick by my statement and maybe in a year or two this editor will be allot better to use.
If you have a solution for a one time event that doesn't involve replacing an NPC or something then post it here and in time (a year or two) I will try again.
It was kinda of fun at least, later.

[Emral]

I'm not even talking about the scripting part now. The event system is limited and and has problems because lets say if I want a ? block to make
toad appear and when I talk to toad he disappears and makes and something else appear, well you are just shit out of luck because of the limited
selection with one each, current layer, destroyed, hit and layer is empty then for NPC'S you have current layer, attach to layer, activate, death, talk
and layer is empty so there is no way for me to link the three events together because of limited options in the proprieties.

?
Make a hit event on the block to show the toad layer.
Make a talk event on the toad that hides the toad layer and shows a different layer.
There.

I don't quite understand what you mean by the other stuff with the 1-up, but you can hide a toad layer in one position and show a different layer with a different toad in another position.
Moving layers only affect blocks and a feeeew limited npcs like mother brain. To get a moving npc you need to hide the static npc toad layer and have a toad replace a goomba or something so it can move. The reason for this is that it'd be pretty shit if a goomba walked at you at lightspeed if it was on a moving layer that it's also standing on, for instance (which would happen if the goomba had the layer's speed applied). Everything would slide around nonsensically.

This isn't even a complex application of the event system. This is the first thread in a decade that I've seen claiming this stuff is difficult, so I'm very sceptical that this is some kind of universal problem.

[jaysparrow]

This if funny. talking to the devs. here is like talking to a damn brick wall.
OK I get what you are saying about the layers now but still your not accepting or maybe getting what I'M saying.
1: The event system is limited.
Add a + sign in the priorities next to the sections boxes to add to current layer, destroyed, hit and layer is empty
then for NPC'S current layer, attach to layer, activate, death, talk and layer is empty.
I think this way it seem like you could make one event to affect Multiple things instead of having to make allot of events for things.
I guess you won't get what I'M saying on this ether.
2: The event system is complicated. (not user friendly)
For me having to guess what damn section to put events in in the priorities just to get them to work.
I not sure how you could rework this but there has to be a better way.
I guess you could totally remake the event system to make it better.
3: The custom part of the editor. (not user friendly)
I guess make some kind of tool like I said before that could add info to the files automatically
for you and lets you edit the info just by loading the ini files.
4: Scripting is required for some things. (not user friendly)
I don't even know where the hell to start on this, I mean you had to make a lives lua script for me because I don't know lua.
Maybe by using a simple system of menus with no programming knowledge required! but I'M not sure if that would work because
I don't know anything about coding but you should know if any of this is possible because you work on it. and are a dev.
It is getting rarer to see devs. that say "if there are problems or something you want in the game don't hesitate to contact me".
That doesn't happen here because you just don't care when people tell you about problems and try to give ideas to make it more user friendly.

[Emral]

It's like talking to a brick wall because our aim is to provide help with the features as they are right now. Our future plans with the engine and what we're gonna do to make more features accessible without scripting are in no way helpful to you accomplishing what you want to make in the systems that exist today (and are more than capable of doing what you need them to).

As for point 1, the eventual plan is to can the system outright and replace it with something entirely different. Hacking in a list structure to the trigger events for blocks and npcs would be much more effort than building something from scratch. I have ignored your ideas because they were not worth commenting on.

As for point 2, this will always be the case from now on. In 2014, scripting didn't exist yet for SMBX. Neither did playing standalone levels outside of the editor. Neither were you able to modify lives without coins, moons or 1-ups. The reason why I needed to write your script is because game overing in standalone levels is not something 99% of people would ever want, so it would be a waste of time to make it accessible.
Since we started SMBX2 we've been working hard to make more and more things accessible without scripting. See for example the level settings, extended section settings, and block, bgo and npc extra settings, as well as music and sound replacement, the episode graphics folder, more NPC config and config files for other types, parallaxing backgrounds, npc packs and the custom range, the list goes on. There are plenty of other things on that list for the future, most of which are marked on the roadmap.
Today, most things you would wanna do are doable without a single line of code (thanks to community contributions), even if you have to jump through a few hoops. But regardless of how far we push that boundary, or how much we overhaul existing accessibility systems, it is impossible to bring that number down to 0. Accessibility of features and user friendliness also stand in direct conflict with one another. As the complexity of the editor and other systems grows, there are more places to get lost in. On the dev team we're strongly striving towards more feature accessibility, which in turn means that there are more things to learn and remember if you wanna master every aspect of the engine. That is fine, that is how specialized creators software tends to work. I still don't know how to navigate photoshop, either.
While the current editor can be a bit unwieldy at times, it is already a massive step up from the one we previously had (no undo button, no multiselect, no right-click at all). We also know that we might eventually need a completely new editor again to cater more strongly to SMBX2 specifically, but that's far off in the future and mentioning that here does absolutely nothing for your problem of not being able to wrap your head around layers.

To reiterate my previous point: My aim in this thread is not to engage in a feature discussion over inflexible systems built in 2009 into an engine we hacked cannot easily directly modify. It's to help you achieve the things you are struggling with by trying to explain how they work in simple terms. The things you are trying are all fairly trivial, and I think if you spend time with the systems you will be able to master them fairly swiftly like everyone else.

[jaysparrow]

well I'm not going to fully read your stupid rant about what I doing wrong when its your editor that's the problem.
You just prove my point on what I said om my last post.
And still most of this editor is not user friendly and not recommend.
If you need help here or have ideas for the editor don't even bother because you will just get allot of **** post from the devs.

[jaysparrow]

Bye and good reddens SMBX.
There are other better, simpler and user friendly editors out there.

[Sonya Sanchez]

well I'm not going to fully read your stupid rant about what I doing wrong when its your editor that's the problem.
You just prove my point on what I said om my last post.
And still most of this editor is not user friendly and not recommend.
If you need help here or have ideas for the editor don't even bother because you will just get allot of **** post from the devs.

This post is so wrong, you asked for help and you even got help so don’t turn and blame the devs for your own errors.

Also sorry but Smbx is by far the most superior editor with lua combined but okay.

[TLtimelord]

well I'm not going to fully read your stupid rant about what I doing wrong when its your editor that's the problem.
You just prove my point on what I said om my last post.
And still most of this editor is not user friendly and not recommend.
If you need help here or have ideas for the editor don't even bother because you will just get allot of **** post from the devs.

Calling people slurs is not productive. Grow up. I don't even know why I'm bothering to engage with you over a layers & events system that while it isn't the best, the majority of us were able to figure it out as 10-12 year olds back in 2010-2012 and so on. Play around with it, learn how to use it. Don't come here bitching that it's everyone else's fault that you didn't have the patience or brainpower to figure it out like the rest of us.