Site Discussion Thread

Postby **Shadow Yoshi** » Wed Oct 28, 2015 12:14 pm

Hey, LordKofu, thanks for posting that. I in no way think you're trying to undermine my authority.

The underlying problem with the graphics request forum is that most of the requests were made by people who didn't have that strong of level design skills. For example, you rarely saw users like Chad, reghrhre, or SuperMario7 requesting graphics, yet they were the ones who were putting out great levels. The problem is that these users who were requesting crazy graphics would rarely make good levels with them, and also that recolors are something that everyone should learn how to do and not request. Removing the requests forum helps further instill the fact that level design is more important than graphics.

Please feel free to ask more questions if you have any.

Emral · Postby **Emral** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 5:52 am

Quick thought on this: If someone new requests a graphic, someone is nice enough to make it for them, posts it in the graphics forum, but we never see the guy who requested it do anything (decent) with it, is that bad?

Because the thing is that, if a graphic has been created and posted, it's available for everyone to use. It prevents people who need it in the future from making it again, even though it could have already been done. And even if it wasn't done, if they're good at pixel art they can then fulfill it.

Now, while I am for the return of a section, be it a forum or a topic, for requests, there are a few things wrong with the previous one which need to be gott en rid of first
- many requests were ridiculous. Playable characters, huge requests over 37 different things. The latter can be fixes by enforcing a rule over having one unsolved request at a time. If the theme is coherent (Toad NPCs for a jungle village as opposed to a Kremlin, a volcano tileset and a vending machine in the same post), multiple graphics can be requested. The biggest suggestions in this case would be a small tileset with some NPCs.
- No playable characters. I know from experience that making such a sheet is the worst, and I wouldn't want to torture anyone by doing one for me. And since playables imply the creator wants to make something advanced and new, and playable characters are a biiig want, forcing the creator to make one if they really so need it, to me, seems to be a better way of denying requests (because it's really tedious for the one who ends up doing the request, as opposed to other requests taking up a fraction of that time and being fun in mose cases)
- make sure the rules are being followed. Everyone who browses the forum to fulfill a request should be familiar with them and point out threads which don't follow them to the one who made it. If the rules aren't met, graphic makers are encouraged to ignore the thread. If the main poster doesn't reply in any capacity, or refuses to change the request to fit the rules, they will be prevented from making further requests for a month or so (and get a PM pointing out the reason)
- make sure people want to fulfill requests. The easiest way to do this would be adding a group similar to the level judges, who moderate the requests forum, fulfill them, and handle the PMs mentioned above. Similar to reviews, requests don't have to be done by a moderator. Anyone with free time can pick a request and do it, especially one with spritesheet provided.

Tl;dr I don't think people have to be good designers to request graphics, the forum just wasn't moderated well enough.

That quick thought went on for a while...

Postby **Shadow Yoshi** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 10:30 am

The problem is that even though there were rules, nobody followed them. The people that use the requests forum are notorious for doing pretty much everything you said people shouldn't do.

Ideally, yes, the requests forum serves a great purpose. However, it rarely was used as such for the duration of its existence here. Requesting graphics that will never be turned into anything useful is a waste of time for the person requesting the graphic and the person making the graphic.

underFlo · Postby **underFlo** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 10:34 am

Joey wrote:Requesting graphics that will never be turned into anything useful is a waste of time for the person requesting the graphic and the person making the graphic.

Not necessarily, even if the requester doesn't use it, the graphic can still be used by the creator or anyone else in case he releases it.

Mable · Postby **Mable** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 11:39 am

Joey wrote:The problem is that even though there were rules, nobody followed them

Let me ask a honest question. How many times had ur staff tell people to read the rules? Probably over a hundred times. And People will never read them and even if they do... nobody will follow anyway. How many times did u guys had to tell people in the "What pisses you off" thread not to talk about others?

http://www.smbxgame.com/forums/v ... 22#p176622

Yet another person did it aka not reading any of the rules. Imo there should be a stricter enforce about that.

Postby **Shadow Yoshi** » Fri Oct 30, 2015 1:01 pm

Well, Spinda, we had things like Snessy the duck as a sprite.

My point is that requests are either too crazy to be useful (since these people rarely, if ever, finish what they're working on) or too easy to be requested. If you'd like to look through the Requests archive to find an actual, useful request that reached completion, please do.

Tinkerbell: We can be stricter with rule enforcement, sure.

Bryan · Postby **Bryan** » Sun Nov 08, 2015 7:11 pm

There's always people who refuse to abide by the rules. They just don't listen and it's a reoccurring issue. People should know how to behave correctly, regardless of age. If someone just doesn't behave, it's a personal issue that needs to resolved on an individual basis.

I just don't think the entire community should be condemned for it. The current rules are fair. People will always find a reason to complain. You could say stricter rule enforcement might improve things, but the only thing it will do is create ruckus from the same people complaining and not listening.

The user base conducts itself pretty well, we just have to keep the dunces on check.

Postby **Shadow Yoshi** » Sun Nov 08, 2015 8:17 pm

Bryan, what's your point? We seemed to be done talking about the requests issue over a week ago. The community wasn't being condemned for anything. Also, I don't know why you went directly to this thread after several months of absence.

Bryan · Postby **Bryan** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:32 am

Joey wrote:Bryan, what's your point? We seemed to be done talking about the requests issue over a week ago. The community wasn't being condemned for anything. Also, I don't know why you went directly to this thread after several months of absence.

I was trying to point out how stricter rule enforcement really won't benefit anyone, it'll just cause more problems. It's happened before! Some major rule is put in place, people cause ruckus and everyone assumes the entire community is immature and full of little kids. While that isn't true.

Tinkerbell brought up stricter ruler enforcement and I just replied with my position on the issue. While yes, it's kind of awkward and a little late or me to reply, it's reoccurring issue and I just wanted to give my opinion on a reoccurring issue and besides it's the site discussion thread so this pertains to it.

Mable · Postby **Mable** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 9:09 am

Then say how would you get people, to take the rules more serious and follow them better.

Also the only stricter thing i wanted was bc of how many times the staff had to tell people not to talk about users in the what pisses you off thread. Or do you like constant warning to people to be reminded of that?

Also the only people that get mad over the major rule are those who think they can do what they want.

Zeldamaster12 · Postby **Zeldamaster12** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:58 am

QUILL IS ADMIN AGAIN OH MAN WHAT

Mable · Postby **Mable** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:09 am

Zeldamaster12 wrote:QUILL IS ADMIN AGAIN OH MAN WHAT

Plottwist Quill was always asmin but he was hidden in the group.

Also masterbros is in the mod group?

Postby **Shadow Yoshi** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:14 am

#StopQuill2015

Zeldamaster12 · Postby **Zeldamaster12** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:15 am

m4sterbr0s has been in the mod group ever since he resigned from admin.

aero · Postby **aero** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 1:50 pm

Joey wrote:#StopQuill2015

#Bias

Zeldamaster12 wrote:m4sterbr0s has been in the mod group ever since he resigned from admin.

I still find it kind of silly for this to be a thing when his last action as staff was a million years ago. m4sterbr0s the dormant mod

Postby **Shadow Yoshi** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 2:05 pm

why does it matter

Mable · Postby **Mable** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 2:12 pm

Joey wrote:why does it matter

Bc it's spooky turtle.

TLtimelord · Postby **TLtimelord** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:32 pm

Joey wrote:why does it matter

I'm sure you'd prefer to not be at all like the admin Knux. Well back in like 2011, Ace was inactive and he was mod for months on end and when I pushed him to demote him, he gave me the excuse "well he's a cool guy"

I'm going to hope you wouldn't even consider giving us that same excuse. Then again, keeping m4sterbr0s as mod won't do any harm, but it doesn't do any good. While most of this community (most is an understatement) is in no way shape or form worthy of a mod position as well as the very small percentage that is worthy is not interested in mod, you should still look for those who are worthy and willing. And if you aren't wanting any new moderators on your team, well, remove him anyway. An inactive mod just plain doesn't look good. It would look better to the community that we have a positive and active mod/admin team.

aero · Postby **aero** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:39 pm

TNTtimelord wrote:
Joey wrote:why does it matter
I'm sure you'd prefer to not be at all like the admin Knux. Well back in like 2011, Ace was inactive and he was mod for months on end and when I pushed him to demote him, he gave me the excuse "well he's a cool guy"

I'm going to hope you wouldn't even consider giving us that same excuse. Then again, keeping m4sterbr0s as mod won't do any harm, but it doesn't do any good. While most of this community (most is an understatement) is in no way shape or form worthy of a mod position as well as the very small percentage that is worthy is not interested in mod, you should still look for those who are worthy and willing. And if you aren't wanting any new moderators on your team, well, remove him anyway. An inactive mod just plain doesn't look good. It would look better to the community that we have a positive and active mod/admin team.

This kind of looks like a bad turn of discussion since it's about staff. But I agree it looks bad, but if m4sterbr0s just wasn't listed it wouldn't matter to anyone anyway, since it's out of sight and out of mind. Also, it's pretty clear favoritism is at play to some extent so it's not really worth discussing until it becomes an actual issue imo.