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I've gotten a couple of requests for this so why not now?

Mafia 37

We're looking for your quality mafia hosting skills and your quality mafia games for our next game!

You've seen Mafia.
You've played Mafia.
Now, it might just be your time to host some Mafia!

Sorry to Waddle Derp and Sanct, but they will not be hosting.


How do I apply?
All you need to do is post your game suggestion in this topic!
However, you must have participated in at least one mafia game in order to host a game.

After you have posted, your two Game Masters, Syndrilevosse and I (there's FallingSnow too but he doesn't show up that often), will edit your post and respond in green at the bottom if we approve.
If we have comments or changes that we recommend, we will edit in red.
Optional suggestions may be in yellow or orange.


Tips to Remember:
Each user may only submit one game, so choose wisely!
Your game should contain around 15-20 players.
Have about 1 mafia member for each 4-5 townies.
Your game doesn't need to be overly complex to be fun and interesting. Sometimes a good combination of roles can produce a better result.
Don't try to go overboard with the custom roles! You don't need to change the entire theme of your game for it to be interesting.


Ready for Mafia?
Think up some ideas!

The year is 1855. The setting, the American West. A team of gangsters, commissioned by a time-traveling oil tycoon from the year 2180 named Big Doyle and led by legendary outlaw Jonny "The Fastest Gun in the West" Peterson, has infiltrated the once-peaceful mining town of Gunshot Gulch, Nevada in order to dig up a plentiful source of oil located below the surface. Oil is exceptionally rare in the late 22nd century and Doyle plans to bring the gallons he would dig up back to his own time, where he will sell it for trillions of euros.
The gangsters' only opposition is the 13 innocent townspeople of Gunshot Gulch who are determined to protect their village. Well, that's not totally right. Thankfully, Doyle was followed back in time by a Time Cop who has taken a vow to prevent the timeline from being altered and to stop the villainous oil tycoon at any cost. Unfortunately, he's already failed the first part, what with making his presence known to villagers in 1855 and all. But that's alright; he can still succeed in the second.
Oh yeah, and there's some prospector who wants all the gold in Gunshot Gulch for himself or something too, no matter who he has to kill. The townspeople will have to deal with all this in...

M32+: Peak Oil, 200 Years Too Soon
Format: Roleflip - 18 Players
This is a roleflip game. Since every player is a unique character, their specific role will be identified when they are killed (by default). However, cardflip colors are still included.

The Gangster Squad
Big Doyle: A greedy oil tycoon from the year 2180. He is the diabolical mastermind behind all of this, and can use cloaking technology to alter his appearance to appear blue if no autopsy is performed on him.
Jonny "The Fastest Gun in the West" Peterson: A legendary outlaw in 1850s Nevada. As long as he's alive, he will be able to kill one player on even-numbered nights, thanks to his incredible quick draw.
Black Bill Redford: Named for his ashen face thanks to his work with explosives, Bill can place a bomb on one player each night that is rigged to explode if that player dies; if so the player will cardflip black with no name revealed. The bombs will decay by the next night.
Mr. Skull: 160 years before he joined the ghost pirate crew, Mr. Skull was a gangster in the Old West. He spies on other players and gives them good bones and calcium, and can visit one player each night to eavesdrop on any host PMs they received.
(All members have contact with each other and conspire to kill one player each night.)
Goal: Eliminate the Prospector and equal or outnumber the townspeople.

The Townspeople
Doc Fesstival: The doctor who performs the autopsy on players every morning and night after someone dies. If he dies, the roleflip mechanic will be retired in favor of regular cardflips, since he won't be able to identify the bodies. He can also choose to permanently retire and disable this ability during the night from Night 2 onwards, which will be announced to the whole game.
Time Cop: A mysterious time cop from the future who doesn't play by the rules. He's extensively researched the population of Gunshot Gulch and can inspect one player each night to learn that player's cardflip color.
Sheriff Westin: Gunshot's sheriff, who has been set aside in his inspection capabilities by the Time Cop. He's looking to build up a posse to combat the gangsters himself, and can reveal his role to one player each night.
Crazy Carl Williams: If Jonny Peterson is the fastest gun in the west, Carl Williams is the craziest. He can kill one player each night, but will lose this ability for one night if he kills an innocent.
One Horse: The only horse in this town, he can sit on one player each night to prevent that player from being night killed. Obviously, he can't sit on himself.
Eric the Bartender: Has no ability, but cardflips blue if not identified by Doc Fesstival.
Lester the Kid: Regular townsperson
Timmy Claymore: Regular townsperson.
Frank Strange: Regular townsperson.
Vinny, the general store owner: Regular townsperson.
The Texan Smoker: Regular townsperson.
Barney the Carnie: Regular townsperson.
TNT Tyrone: A legendary former mercenary who previously worked with Jonny "The Fastest Gun in the West" Peterson. He has been retired for years, but will appear guilty if not identified by Doc Fesstival.
Goal: Eliminate the gangsters and prospector.

The Prospector
Ol' Ben, the Prospector: A crazed and greedy prospector who is obsessed with taking Gunshot Gulch and its oil for himself. Each night, he can kill one player. He can also protect himself by hiding in a hole if someone tries to kill him, rendering him immune to night kills. People don't think of him as a bad guy normally, so he cardflips green if not identified by Doc Fesstival (revealing his stolen gold).
Goal: Be the last player standing.

Syndrilevosse wrote:Resubmission ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

M37?: Elemental Showdown

Water and fire are total opposites that have been at war for ages. The water kingdom has finally managed to gain the upper hand against the fire kingdom in this eternal conflict. As a last resort the remaining four fire elementals have resorted to the extreme, they infiltrated the water kingdom with the sole intention to slaughter them all. But maybe the biggest threat to both sides is the Grim Reaper of Souls who is only here to have a share in the massacre to come.

Fire Elementals (mafia)
-Fire lord: Will protect himself with fire every night, making him unable to be nightkilled.
-Fire mage: Can trap someone in a ring of flames every night, making them unable to do anything the next day. The Fire mage cannot use its ability on night 1.
-Pyromaniac: Can set fire to someone's ballot every night, making the targetted player unable to vote the day after.
-Coal golem: May cover someone in coal dust every night, changing their cardflip colour to black for the day and a night after.

Water Kingdom (Town)
-Water King: Because he is protected bu guards all day and night, it's impossible to nightkill the king.
-Aquamancer: Can drown someone every night. If they kill an innocent, they will lose their ability and cardflip red for a single night.
-Mirror seer: Can look into a mirror of enchanted water and see what a player did the night before once during the game.
-Water spirit: An embodiment of a spirit made of water. Can fit itself through small spaces and inspect someone every night, learning their cardflip colour.
-Frost guard: Can form a shield of ice around a player every night. Protecting them from dying that night. .
-Extinguisher: Can once per game try to permanently destroy someone's fiery ability. The Extinguisher will not be told if he was successful or not.
-Doublevoter: Like a townie, lynch vote counts double.
-Townsperson: Nothing special, can cast a lynch vote.
-Townsperson
-Townsperson
-Townsperson
-Townsperson
-Outsider: Like a townie but purple, doesn't know he is the outsider.

Third Party[/size]
-Grim Reaper: Can steal a player's soul every night, killing the player. If this player had an ability, it will be preserved inside his soul. The reaper can use each of these abilities only once, even if the original player could use it more often. The reaper is allowed to use up to three soul-abilities at once but if he uses any, the reaper cannot kill. The reaper is unable to kill a nightkill immune just like everyone else. If does target one however the immune will be notified the Reaper attacked him that night. Being death and all that, the Reaper cannot be nightkilled himself either.

---

Additional notes
*The Frost Guard can self-protect
*The Mirror seer's ability will reveal what the targetted player did the night before, not why he did it. So if the targetted player killed someone the night before it doesn't automatically mean he is mafia, he might aswell be the vigilante or the reaper.
*The Extinguisher's ability only works on the mafia members, if it targets something else nothing happens and the ability is lost.
*The coal golem's ability makes someone black for a day and a night after it was used. So, if a player gets painted on night 2, they will cardflip black on day 2 and night 3. The black colour applies to both inspection and death.
*Targetting a mafia member will only give the reaper it's individual ability, not the factional kill.
*Even though the reaper can only use three soul-abilities at once, he may stack up as many as he wants.

Syndrilevosse wrote:Being able to miss on the Extinguisher's ability kind of sucks, since the ability can only be used once throughout the entire game.
It checks out.

Pseudo wrote:Syndrilevosse: I think "infect" in Water spirit description is just a typo of inspect, since it learns the target's cardflip color.
Could definitely use clarification on Extinguisher's ability - list of which roles it affects would be good.
As would clarification on the Frost Guard, though it seems likely it's just a normal doctor based on the description.
Pyromancer doesn't seem good for activity. Might be better if it's one-use ability caused the day phase to be skipped altogether or some such, otherwise you'd probably get a day with almost no activity.
Grim Reaper may be a bit overpowered if it can use abilities and kill on the same night. You should allow only one or the other on any given night, or limit it to only one collected ability per night.

Edit:
Looks good

M37: The SMBX North & South War

Mafia (for both South SMBX side & North SMBX side):

• Leader: each side needs a leader. If a leader gets killed, then the leaderless side must surrender!

• Elite Spy: Immune to nightkills

Troops & Town folks who's fighting in the war (for both South SMBX side & North SMBX side):

• Marine force(1-2): Attacks the opponent side's cities with a submarine, dies after the sub gets nuked

• Air force(1-2): Attacks from the clouds, dies after getting shot off the sky

• Townsperson: Nothing.

• Extra Troops: Comes to assist the side only if the sides called for help!

Y'all know, just ignore this idea, I knew Team Battle in Mafia games are a bad idea!

Faction Mafia games is fine, but this is terribly unbalanced and not even formatted like a Mafia game. The Leader's role is also brutal because the Town could win from a random Lynch on Day 1. There aren't even any descriptions of how the roles physically work (just lore) and no special roles really

NintendoOtaku93 wrote:

M37: The SMBX North & South War

Mafia (for both South SMBX side & North SMBX side):

• Leader: each side needs a leader. If a leader gets killed, then the leaderless side must surrender!

• Elite Spy: Immune to nightkills

Troops & Town folks who's fighting in the war (for both South SMBX side & North SMBX side):

• Marine force(1-2): Attacks the opponent side's cities with a submarine, dies after the sub gets nuked

• Air force(1-2): Attacks from the clouds, dies after getting shot off the sky

• Townsperson: Nothing.

• Extra Troops: Comes to assist the side only if the sides called for help!

And yes, this Mafia game is based off the Korean War (In which my grandfather actually fought in.)

Y'all know, just ignore this idea, I knew Team Battle in Mafia games are a bad idea!

I strongly urge you to read the mafia rules first and get a few games of experience before even attempting to create your own game. This monstrosity follows no mafia structure and goes to show that your knowledge of mafia is lacking, so much so that you should probably just observe another game or two and see what goes on and how before playing along.

NintendoOtaku93 wrote:

M37: The SMBX North & South War

Mafia (for both South SMBX side & North SMBX side):

• Leader: each side needs a leader. If a leader gets killed, then the leaderless side must surrender!

• Elite Spy: Immune to nightkills

Troops & Town folks who's fighting in the war (for both South SMBX side & North SMBX side):

• Marine force(1-2): Attacks the opponent side's cities with a submarine, dies after the sub gets nuked

• Air force(1-2): Attacks from the clouds, dies after getting shot off the sky

• Townsperson: Nothing.

• Extra Troops: Comes to assist the side only if the sides called for help!

And yes, this Mafia game is based off the Korean War (In which my grandfather actually fought in.)

Y'all know, just ignore this idea, I knew Team Battle in Mafia games are a bad idea!

In addition to what the others said, you are required to participate in Mafia as a player before posting your own game. Thanks for understanding.

Mutiny is Mean
17 Players
Cardflip
If the amount of living Innocent members equals the amount of living Traitor members, the Traitors win.
All lynch vote targets must be designated in red, and if they are not, they will not count towards the lynching of that target.

After hearing that the crew of Spacebase 115 fended themselves off perfectly fine without outside assistance, a disgruntled member of the Space Police has received a distress signal from a public transport vessel, the Concordia. Surprised to be receiving another distress signal so soon, he rushed to the ship hoping to help, prepared for whatever may be threatening the people there...

-Traitors-
Co-Pilot: Decides with the other Traitors on who to kill each night. Cardflips green.
Hacker: Decides with the other Traitors on who to kill each night. Can choose a player during the night, they may not use their power during the day.
Smuggler: Decides with the other Traitors on who to kill each night. Lynch vote counts for two (except when second lynching is held). Cardflips black when inspected.
Cloaker: Decides with the other Traitors on who to kill each night. Can change their color once throughout the entire game.

-Innocents-
Pilot: Can choose to either host a second lynching during the day where a second player gets lynched, or can inspect any player each night, that player's color will be revealed to the Pilot only. Can't activate both abilities in the same day/night cycle.
Doctor: Can choose a player each day, that player is immune to Traitor kills for the night, if the Bodyguard is targeted with this ability, it has no effect.
Agent: Can choose to kill any player at night. If he kills an innocent, he is automatically lynched off. Cardflips black when inspected.
Bodyguard: Can choose a player each day, if that player would be killed that night, the Bodyguard dies instead.
Politician: Lynch vote counts as two (except when second lynching is held).
V.I.P.: Just like a normal Passenger, only they're immune to being night killed.
Passenger: A normal player with no special abilities. They vote each day to get someone lynched.
Passenger: A normal player with no special abilities. They vote each day to get someone lynched.
Passenger: A normal player with no special abilities. They vote each day to get someone lynched.
Lover: Just like a normal Passenger, only is in contact with the other Lover.
Lover: Just like a normal Passenger, only is in contact with the other Lover.
Suspicious Passenger: Just like a normal Passenger, only cardflips red and doesn't know they are the Suspicious Passenger.

-Space Police-
Space Police: Can choose to kill a player at night, but only if at least one lynch vote was put under that player's name during any day phase. If he kills an innocent, he becomes a Traitor, joining their team, but only being in contact with the Co-Pilot if he is still alive. If he kills a traitor, he becomes part of the Innocents, joining their team and changing his color to green. If he has joined neither team by the end of the game, he wins or loses if the Innocents win or lose.

Pseudo wrote:Looks good,
But with so few greens I feel like you might as well change the Passengers, VIP, and Co-Pilot to blue as well (or vice-versa), especially since there's no sheriff in the game.
Edit: Missed the Pilot's inspection powers before, it's all good in any case. Green Politician is better IMO however.

EDIT: Politician changed to green and Space Police will change to green when joining the innocents to help add green support. Pilot is a sheriff-esque role if that helps any.

--Reserved for game--

Not enough time to make a new game like I want to..., but the new game may get less votes due to being themed to an animé, so here. Direct copy paste form M36.

M34 wrote:

Kōri wrote:

ɈɒƆ bɘƨɿɘvɘЯ

Mafia: Outnumbers the Town and Angelic cat.
Consigliere: Can search one person every night to find out their role.
Consort: Can prevent a person's role from activating.
Corrupt Propagandist: May have a message displayed in the middle of the night. (Twilight-->Dawn)
Forger: May forge other's Last Will.

---

Town: All Mafia Killed, and the cat is either dead or an Angle.
Captain (Sheriff): Can inspect anyone during the night (Twilight-->Dawn) to figure out their allegiance.
Lieutenant: May host a second lynching during the day (Dawn-->Twilight) (May only use this twice)
Propagandist: May have a message displayed in the middle of the night. (Twilight-->Dawn)
Explosive Bodyguard: Once a night, can place a haphazard warning system to protect someone. What makes it haphazard is that it explodes to warn that some is under attack. As a result, It notifies in the town. The person visited gets notified who all visited them that night as well. (The explosion cancels out all abilities and assassination attempts on that person. The warning system is permanent until activated.)

System wrote:An explosion went off last night. Everyone rushed out side to see that ________'s home was covered in smoke.

Witch: Immune to nightkills, but does not know she is a witch.
Cadet: When the Captain and/or Lieutenant dies, s/he is notified of the death, and gets to either take on the Captain or Lieutenant's ability. Her/his cardflip color becomes Pink if both abilities are taken, else turns blue.
Townie: Can choice to vote publicly or via ballot box.
Townie: Can choice to vote publicly or via ballot box.
Townie: Can choice to vote publicly or via ballot box.

---

Third party
Demonic Cat with Angel Wings and a Halo (DCwAWaaH for short): Wins the game based on the side she/he choices. Can switch on even days only (dawn-->twilight). If Angle, Lynch vote counts as three, Can inspect a person to find their role, and wins if the following roles are dead:

System wrote:Consigliere
Consort
Forger
Explosive Bodyguard
Witch
and both Propagandists

or with the town; however, if demonic is chosen, may kill any one person at night (Twilight-->Dawn) with their role revealed on death. Wins if all Blue and Green roles are dead, or with the Mafia.

System wrote:_______(user) has been found ling in the town-square with ________(role) carved into her/his stomach with a lot of cats around her/him.

If DCwAWaaH dies, then the game becomes roleflip.

---

Mechanics:

Twilight(Night)-->Dawn(Day). (This is for lore/abilities making sense.)
Last Will.

Pseudo wrote:resubmission, we're good

Syndrilevosse wrote:resub

Reserved for game

Pseudo wrote:Peak Oil, 200 Years Too Soon

Are all of the townie names unique roles as well, i.e. do the townies know their names? (If so, it would make it easy for them to claim and prove themselves innocent, and Ol Ben's green cardflip would be useless as long as Doc Fesstival is alive, because the Sheriff would ask him for his name after inspecting him).

They are all unique, but that doesn't really ruin anything - you can easily falsely claim which townsperson you are. The Time Cop only inspects for colors so there's no way to prove which townie you are without dying.

This may, or may not be taken seriously
in other words no this is not serious unless you make it out to be serious
Reader "desgresstion" is advised. YES FUCKING DESGRESSTION
M:whatever
Insert your generic name that people like and will always vote for here
Name: WHY IS THIS REAL?

Overly blantant screaming millennials
Elsa: Can freeze people, stopping from talking/ and doing anything the next night and day, usable during the day only. Can be unfrozen by flames. If Carmander votes on them or visits them then they are unfrozen
President Hair Clip-on: Can look and see who is visiting who during the night, up to 2 people and self.
DIO: You were expecting no DIO memes but it was me DIO! Can stop time for the night, stopping all and any abilities from happening. In turn, skipping a whole phase. Since he FUCKING DIES AFTER PART 3 he can only use it once. Oops spoilers... Anyways he can alternatively kill a person a night with a road rolla da. there is no limit to killing but can only be done every other night only if all of his teammates are dead..
The Moe Loli: Can not die at night, if targeted by a night action, they learn the color of said person. (Not everyone that visited them just one single person i.e. the first person who chose to visited you the loli. At most this single ability, can be used up to 3 times. )

LOVE IS SO BLUE GUYS FTW
Editing of the Bosses: Can protect someone during the night. Can bring a person back from the dead only once during the game.
TheDanianfruitman: Has a long name... Thats about it... Other then the fact that if someone one votes for them they learn thier color.
Carmandar: Gen 8 pokemon. Is charizard, WITH A CAR! SO WOW. Can do flamethrower during the day to end it without having a lynch. Can only do this every 2 day (done day 1 can do it day 4 but not day 2 or 3). Can only do so twice in game. After flaming them they will learn your role you next night(not the night after the day, just the next next night, i.e. dont day 1,message is sent night 3 not night 2. Can not do it to save self from said lynch. can unfreeze people visiting them. (can visit day and night) If they are not frozen they get the message they were met by a guy on fire (with song included)
TheEEM of the O: Is edgy, can suicide to kill to others(up to 2 of choosing). can only be done at night after 2 nights of the game starting. (in game nights)

People in who went to the court of the crimson king
Pro Fighting Game Player: Can protect self at night for about 3 times. There will be a message that someone protected themselves playing against scrubs
Dolphin: This Motherfucka can swim, on LAND. WHOA TECHNOLOGY!!! Can investigate a player and learn their color.
Dio: You were expecting DIO but it was me Dio! Can be a holy diver and fake death during the night. Can only be done if Brando is alive.
Brando: This is a high schooler, he stole your memes. He can control someone and make them use their role on someone else. They will know they have been controlled. Is in contact with Dio

WE GOT TO STOP BULLYING
Cowboy Bebop: Can avoid death once. ONLY ONCE, THEN YOU MIGHT DIE
Susano'o: Can play his edgy theme making the lynch targets voted on the them not count. (Ex. susan uses ability on p1. p2 has 3 votes, p1 has 5, p2 is lynched instead.) More or less protects the player from a lynch. can only be done once.
TIFFANY: Wants to get lynched. if lynched can bring a team together. can decide which them. or reveal 2 player's who voted for TIFFANY their roles to the public.
Stomping fetish terumi: can surive a night or two, depending on who he killed. if he killed his own teammate he lives throught another night or once lynch. can kill someone every other night just to let you know

Everything the light touches is Anime
Anime person man.: they must mention a sort of anime in their posts. must post once a day and night, unless they are dead you butt. Since they do this they can learn a color of who posted below them or quoted them(first quote). They can kill someone who does not mention anime once within their posts. They can copy of someone who quoted them or was the post below them, but the they lose the role they have originally. they dont change teams though.
The Nientendo Switch'o'2: can take a role from the dead and join that team. in turn if they dont choose they live through one night. ONLY ONCE. People know that you changed teams but not who you are.
A.I. Yandere youtuber: can check three people at night to see if they they are Nientend'o' Switcher2. If they are they can choose to kill them if they changed teams. If someone kills Nientend'o' Switcher2 then this role gains the ability to kill every night. If apart of the lynch that killed Nientend'o' Switcher2 can kill someone from that lynvh along with self, or die alone.
The drunk guy: is immune to lynchs until he is the last person on his team. can not talk during the day, but can lynch people in pm and talk in pm only. (discord and irc only for image posting sadly, that's all you can do) is immune to night role abilities that dont kill. can be killed at night. can talk at night. Can choose who to be next to at night (3three people) and learn their pm messages. Every other word will be missing. (Ex. mesg1 : we will kill bobby boo hoo and then go after the player 44, mesg will look like: We kill boo and go the 44) Can choose not to drink at night in order to talk during the day but can not learn pms, and is able to be lynched and is effected by all roles but killing roles will have no effect! (is immune to killing). Can choose not to drink only 2 times. A message will pop up though say the scent of alcohol is gone. Can choose to drink more if your team mates die. can not use the ability to not drink anymore if you are the last one alive

Pseudo wrote:Oh my.
OK, so going to make up some shorthand here:
Red team = Team Millennials
Blue team = Team Blue
Yellow team = Team People
Green team = Team Bullying
Purple team = Team Anime
alright? ok, here we go...
Is the drunk guy intentionally a different color different from the rest of Team Anime? It's a bit redder as is in case you didn't notice.
What "flames" are able to unfreeze those frozen by Elsa? Please clarify.
Carmandar is very overpowered and would discourage activity by existing. I would suggest changing what this role does entirely, I don't think it'd work out well.
A.I. Yandere Youtuber doesn't really work with Mafia mechanics... It's very hard to actually know that someone is who they say they are. I would give the role an inspection ability that only works to check if another player is the Nientendo Switch'o'2 or not.
Overall,
Team Millennials seems too powerful. President Hair Clip-on, DIO, and The Moe Loli together are very very strong. I would suggest nerfing some of these a bit or switching them out with underpowered teams (see below)
Team People and Team Anime seem underpowered on the other hand, since they don't have consistent killing roles or otherwise powerful roles like the other teams (and Team Anime is just really gimmicky)
Stylistically, I approve. But I do not approve the game, yet. I do think this could be acceptable with changes, though.

Edit: Approved, but with the same warnings as Danny. I think this game would be very difficult to run as well as understand given its complexity and writing style, but it's fairly balanced theoretically.

Syndrilevosse wrote:Even with the changes, there's just this inconsistency that isn't entirely the game's fault, but the fault of the writing style that makes it hard to follow rules. When you are working on a game like this, at least give it an air of seriousness and consistency despite it being a joke game, this will help people (especially the gamemasters) better understand the rules and the mechanics of the game.
I will approve this game for now, but the inconsistencies and writing style really throw me for a spin, and I can't put it at the fault of the roles. It just makes it really hard to determine whether or not something is unbalanced.

Syndrilevosse wrote:Honestly, Jacob, as much as your game is interesting (to say the least), I feel that there is just so much going on at one time that it definitely would not be an enjoyable game. I can't speak on everyone's behalf, but even if you do manage to get it up and ready for voting, I can't expect the game to be taken seriously at all.

You actually posted it

Oh god why

I now know who to vote for

Supershroom wrote:I now know who to vote for

If you or anyone for that matter vote for Jacob's game I will kill you

(and get away with it according to THG1)

I swear to fuck if we get that game and I DON'T get to be DIO

I hope the SMBX community won't vote for the joke game, but they probably will anyway.