Super Mario Bros. X Forums

Results: viewtopic.php?f=69&t=17837&p=258476#p258476

Mivixion wrote:Hey everyone, it's your friendly neighborhood moderator dog here to let y'all know that a new official contest is coming up soon and we need judges! If you are interested in being a judge for this contest, please shoot me a PM with the following information:

-why you'd like to be judge
-what your opinion is on gameplay vs. aesthetics
-what you think makes a good level
-anything else you want me to know

I'm gonna get to this ASAP. I've been waiting for this opportunity!

Ayy, I will give a shot by a compose message.

Finally. Wanted to do this for a while. Who will be going over these applications btw?

oh ye's

Mivixion wrote:a new official contest

Wait, like CC13?

MosaicMario wrote:

Mivixion wrote:a new official contest

Wait, like CC13?

No. CC, or Community Contest, are a series of contests hosted by Valtteri and Quill. This, however, is an attempt to bring official contests back by Mimivixion and Joey.

Intuition wrote:This, however, is an attempt to bring official contests back by Mimivixion and Joey.

I'll be glad if this works out, it's been quite some time since the last contest was held. If it works, it might attract more users to register here.

If it is CC13, great, but oh well. Will it be an episode? I would love to apply when I get to my PC again.

You know what? I'm gonna give this a shot.

Interested.

And who's actually saying that CCs must always be hosted by Quill and Valtteri? Has it been like that from the very beginning? Aren't they a very general thing? Will CC13 be delayed until CC12's episode is finally finished?

Supershroom wrote:Interested.

And who's actually saying that CCs must always be hosted by Quill and Valtteri? Has it been like that from the very beginning? Aren't they a very general thing? Will CC13 be delayed until CC12's episode is finally finished?

No, it hasn't. Valtteri has only been the host since CC5 - before that it was NameUser/Ignoritus hosting them.

It's not a CC but it will be official as in supported by SMBX staff.

One thing I would really like to see in this new contest is a defined judging rubric that makes sense and every judge has to follow. Not only do rubrics (if done right) help visualise where the focus in the contest lies, but they also help prevent ridiculous scenarios where a judge docks or bumps the level's overall score because of a single aspect.

Having a rubric can be grounds for arguing just as much as not having a rubric. If there's severe controversy on a level, the judges should speak with each other, and if they can't agree on anything, the host should have the final say on changing or scrubbing a judge's score.

Doesn't change the fact that rubrics do help the contestants by giving them a feel for what's weighted the most.

Also, wouldn't it make much more sense to use rubrics everyone needs to adhere to for a more organised result? It's much easier to compare results when everyone has the same spread of points for the categories.

Supershroom wrote:Having a rubric can be grounds for arguing just as much as not having a rubric. If there's severe controversy on a level, the judges should speak with each other, and if they can't agree on anything, the host should have the final say on changing or scrubbing a judge's score.

I disagree. Giving a level 10/10 points because of a single clever setup is a far greater topic than giving 6/6 in design for the exact same reason. The point of a rubric is that each aspect gets a distinct value assigned to it. If a judge's opinion "fucks over a level" in this case, it's far less severe than if they were free to modify the score as a whole.
Then again, there are of course more things that factor into this. Such as the judges being good, focused and thorough themselves. I think giving the levels a second go after the first playthrough to form a more solid and neutral opinion on them is a must. A rubric only makes finding that opinion easier.

On that topic, one might find the following helpful: take the middle between minimum and maximum score as your neutral value and view score below that as "-1, -2, -3" etc... and score above as "+1, +2, +3" etc... It's a small tool for judging that gives numbers a bit more value and meaning and might help in making scores more understandable and easier to find.

Anyway that detour aside... the judges don't have to agree on everything, that's ridiculous. We always have multiple judges BECAUSE each judge has their own opinion in what makes a level good. Some people are more generous than others, some more harsh. Controversy on a level can easily prevented if the judges actually talk to each other and tell the problem judge "hey uh that one score you got here... you should probably justify that better in your comment". If you just slap out your results all "lol let's see what happens" you're being lazy and show that no care was put into organising judging as a whole. And that's the point where resulting controversy is the organiser's fault.

All this discussion about rubrics is interesting because that's heavily related to something we're trying out in this contest. We won't release details yet but that's going to be a big thing that separates this from standard CCs.

Sorel wrote:Doesn't change the fact that rubrics do help the contestants by giving them a feel for what's weighted the most.

Also, wouldn't it make much more sense to use rubrics everyone needs to adhere to for a more organised result? It's much easier to compare results when everyone has the same spread of points for the categories.

Yeah, giving out guidelines and rubrics for judges to refer to would keep things snappy, if they were allowed to openly discuss with other judges about their opinions, all it would take is just one judge's opinion to cause a flamewar.

practicalshorty014 wrote:

Sorel wrote:Doesn't change the fact that rubrics do help the contestants by giving them a feel for what's weighted the most.

Also, wouldn't it make much more sense to use rubrics everyone needs to adhere to for a more organised result? It's much easier to compare results when everyone has the same spread of points for the categories.

Yeah, giving out guidelines and rubrics for judges to refer to would keep things snappy, if they were allowed to openly discuss with other judges about their opinions, all it would take is just one judge's opinion to cause a flamewar.

Except judges ARE usually allowed to talk to other judges about why they rank a level the way they do, and if your judges are good they will respect that, maybe offer a new perspective, and lead to further mutual understanding of the levels, creating an even more thorough judging experience. Your judges will only cause an internal flamewar if they're childish.