NightKawata wrote: ↑Tue Jun 07, 2016 2:08 am
I think
EVERY single one of you who have adored this fucking abomination have issues. This is
YET AGAIN more Hello trash. I wish people would stop tugging Hello's boat, in all honesty.
And the reason I'm so irritable about the subject, is that I would personally like Hello to evolve and make something halfway decent.
This is not an example of something halfway decent. Not in the slightest. You would think in 10 years you've learned how to make a decent fucking mario game. It took Redigit about a few months, all in all; and do you know what he created? The most solid Super Mario fangame to date. Nothing beats SMBX in terms of polish, in all honesty. I know you guys probably have gripes with it, but if you look at the alternatives... Yeah.
Let's start with your initial presentation. It lacks care. The name "Mario Editor" is pretty generic, and for a second, I almost thought you ripped off Mario Builder.
A trailer should also NOT be 9 minutes long, and SHOULD NOT be overflowing with hardcore dubstep. I don't know who in the marketing team thought that was a good idea. Fire them. I could not watch that trailer. I'd commit sudoku.
I can also tell right off the bat this game lacks the "charm" that Level Master and Game Master had. At least with those, there were a few sample levels. Granted, they weren't
good sample levels, but at least effort was thrown into them. I'm at least going to give you credit where credit is due. The tutorial level is... mediocre, at best. I didn't like it due to the engine itself. I'm going to yell at you some more about that soon.
ANOTHER FUCKING PROBLEM IS THIS SHITTY FUCKING FILTER THAT I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHY YOU THOUGHT IT WAS A GOOD IDEA
Seriously. What the fuck. That fucking shitty HQ4X filter that's applied by default. Change it. Immediately. In fact, burn it.
This does not look good. Anyone who thinks this looks good has a problem. (granted, it's probably subjective, but in most cases, I'm sure anyone can agree this looks like fucking trite)
I'm aware that you can change the filter. I had to actually open the game's manual (something a user shouldn't really need to do in most cases if basic intuition is applied) to figure that out. Well, that's not true. A colleague of mine opened the manual and told me about it. But SOMEONE had to open the manual. Not good. A manual should still exist to provide lots of interesting information, add charm, and generally provide a good ground to learn the device itself. I should open a manual, learn everything I need to, and get some good mileage out of it.
You failed that. It's a list of controls, and an advertisement for shitty games. I appreciate you
probably tried, but it's lazy. Teach me all the tutorial's workings inside the manual. Provide easter eggs. Make it fun to read. Don't make it a pile of trash, or something I shouldn't even bother looking at. I should read a manual and be glad I read it. Instead, I was irritated. Especially when "Alt+(X)" is how you change the filter. No function keys? Really?
I also want to ask WHY you even decided to add HQ2X and HQ4X filters. They ruin spritework. I don't know many people that aren't deranged that actually like those filters. That may just be me, but I think it personally ruins the quality of spritework. I want to admire pixels in 1080p and enjoy what I see. Not a smoothed out mishmosh and a conflicting art-style. It clearly doesn't belong. A resizable window would also be lovely, but given how terribly made the Hello Engines are, I doubt it's possible. Even Metanet Hunter CD doesn't provide the option to dynamically resize the window, but that's primarily because I'm not entirely sure how I should go about it. I did at least try, but it ended up with some issues with lower-resolution monitors. Quite unfortunate. I at least offer the option to choose the game's scale, and fullscreen right from an options menu.
Ah right, let's talk about more failure: Why isn't there a fucking options menu? That's standard grade nowadays, and requires basically zero effort to insert into the game. Rebindable controls would be great, and I THINK you've actually done that in previous projects, Hello. I don't remember off hand, because all of your games are typically poor and blend together; or stick out for the wrong reasons. I'm looking at your puke green filter and terrible level design in Super Mario Dynamo. Oh, and Super Mario Eclipse's horrific rainbow filter that physically hurts my eyes. Another thing I would like to see is Gamepad support. I know Game Maker is capable of it. Even Redigit managed it with Visual Basic. I'm sure you could do that very easily. Start adding that to your next game, if this post doesn't send you into shock. I'm sure you could also find some more mileage out of an options menu (perhaps choosing the bloody fucking filter through there as well), so it's something you should consider.
Also, if I may add another comment: DO NOT ENCOURAGE BAD LEVEL DESIGN. What is wrong with you? I got killed by a random invisible poison mushroom triple block. Granted, I'm aware that was the point. But I'm also aware one should NOT encourage bad level design all across the board. Unfortunately, MFGG (and this forum in particular) adopt similar practices of mediocre level design. Even my level design isn't top-tier, and I certainly won't deny that. But, much like a good porno, I know good design when I see it. Actually studying game design and striving to be the best you can be will do that to you. Unfortunately, Hello doesn't exactly know what that means. And after 10 years, I'm both irritated beyond all fucking belief, and disappointed. It's wasted talent.
I don't particularly love the UI. I find it "cute" that you based it off of Mario Maker, but here's the problem with that:
Mario Maker did it a hell of a lot better. There's no charm in the UI, at all. Just annoying sounds. I believe Mario Maker added cutesy sounds when you place stuff, and actual charm. Learn from that. You didn't do that. Instead, you decided to add the same sound for pretty much every block being placed. Granted, I didn't fiddle around with your editor enough to particularly care. I don't have a deathwish.
Tiled is probably the best example of a great tilemap editor, and I'm spoiled by the terrain tool. It's so beautiful. While I'm at it, I will give credit to PGE by Wohlstand (I think that's how his name is spelt?), as his editor, while clunky, is still generally pleasant to work with once you learn the ropes. Wohlstand also put a hell of a lot more effort into his manual, and he doesn't even natively speak English. Props. You've got someone to learn from, Hello. ...Well, you've got 100 things to learn.
Let's talk about the audio issues:
- The voice clips are overused. That's not my biggest problem, granted; but it's still enough of an issue that I have to bring it up. If there's anything you're going to do, don't mix games together of various audio quality and expect that not to be noticeable. It's lazy, doesn't sound good, and doesn't prove you put effort into this project. Granted, you do that constantly. I doubt you're going to fix that. Stay to one game, or remove all the bloody voice clips altogether. I don't feel giddy when I hear Mario shout "I got it!" In fact, in the legend of zelda lttp (GBA), Link makes a really fucking annoying sound when he swipes his sword. The same effect is in place here. Please remove that. It doesn't add charm.
- God fucking damn do you know what the word theming means? SMBX technically has the same issue, but SMBX also offers a ton of graphical styles inside its package. There's about 8 different games mish-mashed into the game's "soundtrack," and their quality vastly differs. SMBX at least had them all in low-quality. I don't understand what's going on with the audio in general. It's typically low-quality rips regardless, but you ought to look into that. It's off.
- I've had issues on a few computers where the audio simply won't load in your games. You're doing something... peculiar, aren't you? Haven't seen it in other game maker games, so I'm not sure what's up with that.
Now, onto more problems.
You should have explained what these do in the game's manual. I'd rather not buy Game Maker studio to figure that out. I'm sure you didn't need to, so I can't take away too many points for that.
I at least appreciate that there aren't 100 different DLLs in the game's directory. I hate when games do that, since it looks unrefined and rather shite. I'm looking at you, SMBX 2.0. I don't know why there's so many, I don't WANT to know, and that's the end of that. Don't ruin my fun.
Settings.ini and Options.dat could have been condensed into one file, presentation-wise. I don't know what options.dat even does, since it's literally 3 numeric values, seperated by returns. I don't really like tweaking with game settings if it's not properly explained, so I'd rather not suddenly cause my computer to erupt.
The aesthetics of the game.... Personally, I really hate when people try to mix graphical styles that were never intended to blend together. It never works, and never looks good, contrary to what the majority of the community believes. A lot of things are bizarrely SMB3 styled, and don't quite look right. However, this is an issue in general with even the SMBX community, so... I GUESS I can't make too many comments here? It's always rather bizarre. ...At least there aren't more Black Squirrel tilesets. Fucking hated how overused those were.
Let's now talk about HOW FUCKING AWFUL the Hello Engine is.
I don't know if you've heard of the term quality, but good fucking lord, the engine is a mess. I find it hard to believe that the Hello Engine is a clean, well-commented sanctuary. I highly doubt that. It's at least probably not as bad as Redigit's code (....ugh.), or Notch's, but from my travels, Hello isn't particularly known for a very solid engine. Something that becomes even more susceptible once code becomes available to the general public. The physics do not feel fluid. In fact, they're rather awkward, all things considered. Mario's general control is rather poor, I find the fire flower seems to jitter, I don't care (or REMEMBER) about the 30 powerups that are plastered all over the game, and the way they spawn is sometimes scary. A leaf came out, went 200mph into the air, and suddenly started fluttering awkwardly. Not good. I had a similar problem with a moving platform, where it suddenly decided to go too fast, and I died. This kind of nonsense is why I haven't added moving platforms to the Metanet Hunter codebase. If it doesn't work right, I wouldn't add it.
Most of the enemies tend to behave rather erratically, as well. I don't even want to talk about the Bowser fight in this game, either. (It's not good.)
You really ought to reiterate your AI programming. It scares me to the Nth degree.
Let's also mention that the game fails to run properly in general due to the shitty fucking default filter (it runs equally as bad with the filter disabled) and poor optimization in general; the game tends to dip to around 40FPS, and my graphics card isn't exactly shite. I'm not running an AMD E1 with some $5 video card I stole from someone. Nope, I bought my computer with tax money and saving from my job. But enough about me. I can run most games perfectly fine, but if I can't run a Mario, the Mario clearly has a problem. Oh no!
Oh yes, none of this is true.
I wouldn't want to play anything made with this. I'd rather pull out my hair. And for those of you who don't know, I have a
lot of hair. It'd be painful.
with a well-organized, well-polished engine, this shouldn't happen. It's minor, but there's _a lot_ of minor problems like this.
My favorite powerup is Green Glove Mario. The walljump is equally as great. And by that I mean both elements make me want to kill myself equally.
May I also note that the fucking hammer brother right there shoots hammers WAY too often. I have no idea how I would actually avoid that in a practical situation.
Don't pay attention to how much effort I put into that "level." It's the equivalent of how much effort was put into this game.
I would like to provide evidence that I'm not the only one who disapproves of Hello.
There's a reason his main games have such shit scores. Mario Editor doesn't have a low score because nobody's reviewed it yet.
In the end, I'm not posting all of these points because I personally hate Hello. I hate that Hello refuses to change, or listen to the community. It's an extremely notorious issue, as well. It's been going on for years, and the people who keep sucking his Super Mushroom DO NOT help to the overarching issue. I'm going to start making fun of people, and get a warning.
Tinkerbell wrote:Tbh i actually enjoyed this more then smbx.
I hope this is sarcastic.
I sincerely hope this is sarcastic. This post made me want to actually type out all of this. Well, that, and I heard Hello made a new game, it didn't impress me, and I finally wanted to give my thoughts on something.
SMBX is an infinitely better product than this piece of garbage. In fact, Mario Editor does borrow some items from SMBX, such as the blue kuribo shoe, which, is named as weeb-like as you'd expect. I'm pretty sure Super Mario Game Master also tried to capitalize on the whole "let's make a mario game good" train Although honestly, I'm pretty sure this is a ripoff attempt to make something to compare to Mario Maker. It fails that, but hey, A for effort. Actually, fuck that. F-.
Honestly, even Super Mario Level Master was better than this. When a game that's god knows how old is better than your current project, you've clearly got a problem.
MrPunchia wrote:I've seen this on MFGG. It seems quite polished, so I might check it out sooner or later.
My fecal matter has more polish than this. It's even less polished than Super Mario Level Master and Game Master; that's really fucking sad. I know I just reiterated my earlier point, but it's still bloody fucking valid. A game developer typically tries to achieve increasingly great work with experience, not a lazy pile of bollocks.
MightyMerlinStyle wrote:So I finally got a chance to try this out. It fixes a lot of the problems I had with Game Master, and has an even more polished feel and aesthetic that's comparable to Mario Maker.
Overall it's a cool tool to play around with, but you can't make entire games with it like you could in Game Master (which is fine because we already have the main Hello engine and SMBX for that)
NO.
Have you actually played Mario Maker?
HAVE YOU?
The aesthetic is nowhere near comparable to Mario Maker. Do NOT insult that game by comparing it with this abomination.
Granted, a massive team over at Nintendo worked extremely hard on that project, but think about SMBX for a second, which has a very solid level of quality, and was built by one person.
The UI itself is quite lazy, aggravating to work with (granted, that's because I'm spoiled by infinitely more convenient tools), and nowhere near as solid as other editors I've seen.
GregoryTheGamer wrote:The Hello mario engine has potential. I'm remaking my game with it
It has zero potential. It's been slowly spiraling into the thirteenth layer of Hell for years now. It's never gotten that much better. Sure, later iterations are better by comparing it to THEIR standards, but looking at it generally, they're a shitstain. Most fangames typically are (sorry to offend literally everybody, but you know who you are. I'll call you out if you really want.), so it's nothing new. The fact that someone who's been making games for 10 years still can't get a formula right is really fucking sad.
Sewpah wrote:This looks really nice! It's Mario Maker, only 16-bit and with slopes. I might try it out someday.
I have a lot of comments I'd personally like to make about those statements. So are a lot of people in response to my ironwall. I'm not going to listen to them, and you're not going to listen to me; I'll spare the effort here.
Just imagine a facepalm.
in fact.
fuck that.
here.
Spoiler because it's too big and I didn't care enough to find a smaller one.
Berkian wrote:Wow, that tool is very excellent! Over 10 years you working a lot in the history of the Mario fangames. Mario Editor compared to Super Mario Maker is better. Best wishes of fangame and good work, Hello!
I know you guys have low standards, but god damn.
I know I also sound REALLY harsh here, but that's because I really would like to see people make some fantastic work. Humans are capable of such, it's all about the effort, determination, and experience. I have no idea what Hello does in his spare time, as he's vocal exactly 1% of the time, but it's clearly not learning how to actually make a good fucking game.
....Wait a minute.
Did you just say Mario Maker is worse than this?
DID YOU REALLY. JUST SAY THAT.
I'm fucking done. NEXT.
Ace wrote:It's been 10 years of mario games from you. Don't you think you could have made a real game in this time? Redigit did it and look how it turned out for him.
Redigit also has a brain. It's why he's successful. And married. And has kids. And a popular icon. (Actually, multiple)
Yes, these things called "brains" are very powerful, aren't they? Perhaps if a certain "veteran" were to use his, he'd produce an actually fucking acceptable product.
Tinkerbell wrote:h2643 wrote:Looks pretty great, and the UI is kinda similar to the one in Mario Maker
The big difference tho is... this has slopes
The big difference tho is... this has no flavor to it
Linik wrote:Enjl wrote:Where is Ninja Bomberman?
Also, where is Snake? Where is Zelda? Where is Mega Man? Where is Rosalina? Where is Samus?
How about,
WHERE'S THE GOOD GAME? Where's the product that shows someone's truly worked for 10 years, and confidently displays his proud work to an audience willing to honestly review such?
It doesn't exist, because some people will accept anything if it conforms to their beliefs. Or some people like to watch the world burn. Perhaps some people are also blind. I'm not sure any more.
I hope I don't become this senile in my 10th year of game development. If I make something like
THIS, please execute me. I won't want to live.
Artemis008 wrote:This has a bit more polish then SMBX but it's not nearly as flexible.
Absolutely not. I hope you're jesting. YOU MUST be blind.
All in all, I give up. My post is going to get attacked immediately, because I've purposely offended nearly everybody in this topic, since it seems we could all use a coffee or so.
I'm not going to counter-argue anyone's reaction, unless someone sees where I'm coming from here.
After 10 years, someone should be able to make a decent product. After 10 years, someone should know how to work something. How to blend it together for the best results. Hello technically has more experience than even I.
I'm not sure how much of a brain he has, though.
And, to Hello:
Learn from your mistakes/ I want to see you succeed. I really do. I'm not trying to be harsh in attempt to offend you. Moreover, to open your eyes. Realize what you're doing is currently failing, and needs to be ripped out from underneath the floorboards, built into something infinitely better. I'm sure somewhere you most likely have potential. Hell, I'll even help you find it should you choose. I need a partner in crime, anyways.
To note one more thing: Does anyone know the definition of insanity?
It's doing the same fucking thing over and over again, and expecting different results. This is the general idea for most of Hello's profile. Every game blends together, and besides the unnecessary Mario gun games he's made, I could not tell you which one is which were I blindfolded. Every single game typically has the same exact set of problems, from terrible level design, to terrible execution, to cringe-worthy writing, or even a horrific engine that needs to be rebuilt from the ground up. Yet more Hello games turn up. Like weeds. They're not very different, save for some minute details, yet they're still all over the garden. It's not alright. Let me be one of the few to actually spark a flare here, and not praise toilet-level quality. Indie developers are perfectly capable of making good games.
SMBX.
Cave Story.
Braid.
Super Meat Boy.
all are a few ancient examples. These were also built with programs that aren't up-to-date. Game creation is a piece of cake nowadays, but that brings another problem: It makes it too easy for someone to breed garbage.
But at least game development is accessible, I suppose. I don't see how someone can make something so poor and be given accolades for no good reason. In fact, MFGG bashes Hello constantly for making shitty fucking games, so I'm not the only blind one here.
I'm just hoping someone listens here.
I also really hope most of the responses here are sarcastic.
Or I'm gonna shoot.
I'm also going to say this now: If you're going to attempt to rip apart my post, don't waste your time. You've got better things to do, and so do I. Just say you disagree. And the world will be a better place. If you don't agree about my delivery; well, I don't either. At least we'll have something in common.
I never liked flame wars in the first place.
(also inb4 I get warned, this post was extremely abrasive for a reason)
TLDR
qig wrote:its like mario maker but without realizing what makes mario maker so itneresting in the first place
qig wrote:qig ♯TEAMLITTEN: b-but it has slopes guys xD
