When I played some levels in SMBX I sometimes try to play them as Link, they're impossible to complete because he can't use Mario-based powerups like Yoshi and Propeller Blocks. There are quite a lot of levels that require you to use those objects such as a few of the contest levels that I've played, so if you pick Link, you're screwed. As well as this, the Zelda tilesets are extremely limited as well as the enemy choices, so you have to be over-reliant on custom graphics most of the time if you want to make a Zelda level. Why is there so much hate for Link?
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 3:35 am
by underFlo
Didn't you already explain it in the op? He's more limited than other characters and requires levels specifically made for him most of the time. Most people disregard him when making their levels because of that. I wouldn't call it hate, no one says "lonk sux zomg",.he's just rarely used,' which I canjunderstand.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 3:38 am
by bossedit8
Link is not a Mario based character, Link is basically weak at most at platforming and also he beats regular bosses with ease. Oh and here's a video about link being rare in SMBX:
I think the topic title should be "Why do people design Mario-themed levels in this Mario fangame?"
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 8:38 am
by mechamind
Let's say you hit a brick wall based gimmick. Link is the only one who can break through them without a power-up.
You can bounce off of floors that normally result in damage if I recall.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 8:54 am
by underFlo
Emral wrote:I think the topic title should be "Why do people design Mario-themed levels in this Mario fangame?"
Pretty much this.
I just realised that if you design a Mario-ish level dlso that Link can complete would really limit you because spikes won't be a danger for link and he can't use key items/they work differently. You'd have to not use these items at all if you wanna make it balanced.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 9:13 am
by RudeGuy
Nickname wrote:and he can't use key items/they work differently.
Link can use keys. He can't just use things that needs to be grabbed.
Aside from this, Link can pretty much do everything every other characters can, and sometimes even break their gameplay (for example he can destroy a wall of bricks) or being limited in certain cases (Link starts to run a bit after than every characters, this means he can't go past huge holes in some cases).
Most levels makes use of items that needs to be grabbed, or having something that Link can break, that's why he isn't used often and is usually blocked in episodes.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 9:16 am
by Emral
RudeGuy07 wrote:
Nickname wrote:and he can't use key items/they work differently.
Link can use keys. He can't just use things that needs to be grabbed.
Key items doesn't refer to keys. It refers to items which need to be grabbed.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 9:37 am
by underFlo
RudeGuy07 wrote:
Nickname wrote:and he can't use key items/they work differently.
Link can use keys. He can't just use things that needs to be grabbed.
Aside from this, Link can pretty much do everything every other characters can, and sometimes even break their gameplay (for example he can destroy a wall of bricks) or being limited in certain cases (Link starts to run a bit after than every characters, this means he can't go past huge holes in some cases).
Most levels makes use of items that needs to be grabbed, or having something that Link can break, that's why he isn't used often and is usually blocked in episodes.
By key items I was referring to important items, like Propeller Blocks or even Yoshi.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 9:59 am
by MECHDRAGON777
In The Invasion co-screen with bossedit8, I used Link more to just use him...
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 12:40 pm
by Mable
The Thread title is dumb sry but you can't just write it like "Why is there so much Link hate?" I don't remember anyone who said something hateful about him. It's just that he doesn't work for the majority of levels bc people mostly only create them for Mario and Luigi. Same goes with Peach and Toad if you required to do something only Mario and Luigi can you can't go further.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 12:40 pm
by Superiorstar
What hate?
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 10:18 pm
by HenryRichard
Superiorstar wrote:What hate?
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2015 10:21 pm
by Shidomaru
bossedit8 wrote:and also he beats regular bosses with ease
Not if you put every enemy in jumphurt=1 and/or playerblocktop=0 like I did when I was working in my Castlevania-style project. Yes, Boom Boom is still easy as fuck, Birdo downgrades into a regular enemy, Mouser can be easily trounced by packing a few of his bombs into your inventory and throwing them all back at him at once, and Wart, the hardest boss for Mario and company, becomes piece of cake... BUT Larry Koopa and Ludwig Von Koopa become a pain in the ass when you can't stomp them and you MUST rely on your sword alone. The two Bowsers are still as hard as with anybody else.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 1:45 am
by TLtimelord
Sinem wrote:The Thread title is dumb sry but you can't just write it like "Why is there so much Link hate?" I don't remember anyone who said something hateful about him. It's just that he doesn't work for the majority of levels bc people mostly only create them for Mario and Luigi. Same goes with Peach and Toad if you required to do something only Mario and Luigi can you can't go further.
HenryRichard wrote:
Superiorstar wrote:What hate?
I think you guys are just focusing on castlewars' lack of good wording in the title and missing the point. He wonders why Link is never used and generally seemingly ignored.
Well, it's pretty much been answered already. Link doesn't work well in very many of the levels we make in this community. The levels we make are meant for the Marioverse characters. Link is almost always either overpowered or underpowered unless someone makes a level where he is meant to be used in.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 2:26 am
by bossedit8
We really should make a SMBX Episode where Link is allowed to play on pretty much every single levels in it so we can have a fun time playing it. Of course it's actually difficult to manage since you need to test your game a lot of times but once you manage that, you will be able to make a SMBX Episode where every characters is playable.
I really like some of Link's mechanics. I think he is pretty good for normal levels, OP in some levels and terrible in other levels. I am more surprised that he isn't used in puzzle styled games where you have to switch characters all the time either way, since he would add a lot more oppurtunities.
Maybe people don't ignore Link, but they ignore every character except the one they are playing. Usually that is not a problem, but Link simply is too different, so chances that the level gets broken for Link is very high.
He is bad at accelerating, jumping off leaders, he can't duck jump properly making it difficult to evade things in some situations, (and causing you to glitch through floors more easily when you are in a small gap) he can't grab things which makes levels that are designed for use of things like bullet bill guns a lot harder, and some levels even impossible.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 7:32 am
by Emral
Fennor wrote:I also wouldn't use Link in a storydriven Mario game.
When was the last time SMBX was strictly about Mario? You can make sprite-swaps here and there and suddenly have a fangame for an entirely different franchise. This is why the only thing this community needs to learn to make Link work is designing levels around him, rather than the plumbers, the fruit or the shroomhead.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 8:38 am
by Fennor
Enjl wrote:
Fennor wrote:I also wouldn't use Link in a storydriven Mario game.
When was the last time SMBX was strictly about Mario? You can make sprite-swaps here and there and suddenly have a fangame for an entirely different franchise. This is why the only thing this community needs to learn to make Link work is designing levels around him, rather than the plumbers, the fruit or the shroomhead.
I didn't mean to say SMBX has to be a Mario game. Mine was just an explanation why people don't mix the two universes. Of course people could also make a game just about Link and instead exclude all the Mario characters. But people are less likely to do that, not neccessarily because they hate Link, but because most of the default graphics and sounds are already there.
And maybe also mario fans are more likely to get into SMBX in general, since it still is advertised as a Mario editor. (the name is SMBX, the interface of this forum is full of mario characterss) A Zelda fan who finds SMBX would pay less attention to it after finding it and may leave before he even knows that Link is a playable character and that there are a few Zelda graphics.
Re: Why is there so much Link hate?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 3:35 pm
by Mable
Link is practically the only playable that can spinjump on munchers which adds a new gimmick you can do to him.