Mafia Discussion

[HeroOfRhyme]

Probably does elsewhere. I dont see why not here. Maybe its the people?

[underFlo]

Probably does elsewhere. I dont see why not here. Maybe its the people?

I also play Mafia on somw other places, and I have to say the general stance here is quite different. Pointing out these small things in one's posts that are a little suspicious is norm there, but ofc this only leads to a lynch if it adds up.

[Zeldamaster12]

I play Mafia here and on KoolKat's forum.

[Sevennights]

Same here.
I do know that joey played one game but he most likely does not play it anymore due to lack of time.

[Shadow Yoshi]

I haven't played in a while because after M4 I became really busy with stuff. The last game I played outside of here was in the end of July. I'll sign up for M14 probably, since I have more free time now.

Logs of an interrogation (important parts bolded, comments in red):

Spoiler: show

<Nighthawk> hey joey
<Nighthawk> what's up
<Joey> yo
<Nighthawk> what are you planning on doing about mashi (Mashi had recently claimed traitor in the game thread)
<Joey> not sure at this point.
<Joey> i thought about a group seering because some of them would be right
<Joey> but that was kind of a bad idea
<Nighthawk> what do you mean a "group seering"?
<Joey> i meant a lot of us seering him at once
<Joey> because the number of seerings > the number of possible paintings (this was a unique game, everyone was a seer and Mafia/traitors had painting powers)
<Nighthawk> yeah but doesn't it only take one seering?
<Nighthawk> sorry
<Nighthawk> i think one painting affects all seerings that phase
<Joey> oh wait a sec
<Joey> yeah you're right
<Joey> i'm not sure though
<Joey> that made a lot of sense in my head save for the fact that it'd waste seerings
<Joey> i also thought about adding mashi to my "people i trust" list and then seeing if i die when falling
<Nighthawk> the problem with that is if i'm a wolf
<Joey> then what
<Nighthawk> wait hm
<Nighthawk> if mashi's actually a traitor then you die
<Joey> yeah
<Nighthawk> the thing is that we don't really care if mashi lives to the end of the game
<Joey> lol
<Joey> i kinda wanted to use one of my powers tonight but i'm not sure who to use it on
<Nighthawk> If I use my power tonight I'm planning on using it on someone who I don't think others will use their powers on
<Joey> yeah
<Joey> i have to head out for a bit, i'll be back in a few hours probably
<Nighthawk> all right
<Nighthawk> i'll continue to think about this!
<Joey> sounds good

...

<Nighthawk> Hey Joey are you there?
<Joey> sup
<Nighthawk> I got some good news.
<Nighthawk> Last night
<Nighthawk> I asked sauce about painting mechanics
<Nighthawk> If both the wolves and the traitors paint a person, the color that person is seered is determined randomly
<Nighthawk> So I decided to paint and seer the same person in the hopes that the wolves would paint themselves blue and I might come into contact with one.
<Nighthawk> And it worked!
<Nighthawk> The other traitor's Jester, by the way.
<Nighthawk> Who's the second wolf?
<Joey> hmm
<Joey> are we sure about Mashi?
<Nighthawk> what do you mean are we sure about mashi?
<Nighthawk> like whether or not he's telling the truth?
<Joey> yeah
<Nighthawk> I'm a traitor, and my role PM says Jester's the other one.
<Joey> <Nighthawk> So I decided to paint and seer the same person in the hopes that the wolves would paint themselves blue and I might come into contact with one.
<Joey> who did you paint/seer
<Nighthawk> I'm saying I seered you blue but I painted you red.
<Joey> Oh.
<Joey> So that makes me...an orange seer? I'm missing something
<Nighthawk> no it means you painted yourself blue
<Joey> but i didn't
<Nighthawk> are you sure your partner didn't send in a late pm
<Joey> I don't have a partner
<Nighthawk> but then why were you seered blue when i painted you red?
<Joey> bcuz sauce is trippin
<Joey> I have no idea
<Nighthawk> hm
<Joey> I'm still fuzzy on how you came to that conclusion in the first place!!!
<Nighthawk> Basically I'm a traitor
<Nighthawk> and in order to look for wolves I'd seer the same person I painted red.
<Nighthawk> If they're any color other than red, it means that a wolf painted them that color.
<Nighthawk> I seered you blue.
<Nighthawk> So you must have been painted blue by a wolf
<Nighthawk> But a wolf would only paint themselves blue
<Nighthawk> so you must be a wolf.
<Joey> here's the thing though
<Joey> <Nighthawk> If they're any color other than red, it means that a wolf painted them that color.
<Joey> a wolf or a traitor.
<Joey> right?
<Nighthawk> yeah but I'm a traitor and I know the other traitor
<Joey> curveball though i seered you red last night, so who painted you? (I did actually seer him red)
<Nighthawk> and he tried the same thing on Damo
<Nighthawk> I have no idea.
<Joey> Hm.
<Joey> How much have you talked to Jester?
<Joey> Over the course of the whole game
<Nighthawk> Not a whole lot
<Nighthawk> you think he went rogue and painted you blue?
<Joey> wait
<Joey> <Nighthawk> If both the wolves and the traitors paint a person, the color that person is seered is determined randomly
<Joey> by "determined randomly"
<Nighthawk> Randomly between those two
<Joey> okay
<Joey> well someone must have, assuming you're telling me the truth, which i have not a lot of reason to believe since i seered you red
<Joey> and you being a red seer would go against your claim
<Nighthawk> maybe the wolves painted me red?
<Nighthawk> oh right you'd know if the wolves painted me red
<Joey> i would?
<Nighthawk> you are a wolf right
<Joey> ah, i see
<Joey> so what does this make Mashi?
<Nighthawk> a human i guess
<Joey> why would he claim traitor
<Nighthawk> there's a chance he's a wolf trying to look human but he certainly isn't the traitor.
<Nighthawk> To find wolves I guess
<Nighthawk> So who did you paint if you didn't paint me?
<Joey> I didn't paint anyone because I'm merely a seer
<Nighthawk> OK then, let's take a step back.
<Joey> alright
<Nighthawk> I lied about being a traitor.
* Joey sighs
<Joey> okay
<Nighthawk> Which also means I lied about seering you
<Nighthawk> and painting you
<Nighthawk> I actually seered Jester red.
<Nighthawk> I'm planning on trying this with a few more people.
<Joey> I still seered you red, for what it's worth.
<Nighthawk> Was I actually red though?
<Nighthawk> oh
<Joey> yeah
<Nighthawk> that's really interesting.
<Nighthawk> Because a third red seering means either the wolves didn't paint themselves blue tonight like I assumed they would
<Nighthawk> or they did and the traitors painted someone red.
<Joey> well, traitors painting someone red makes sense
<Joey> but there were 3 seerings?
<Joey> also, who did you add to your trust list, if you don't mind me asking? (trust lists were a game mechanic)
<Nighthawk> well I'm guessing someone beyond you and me decided to seer someone
<Nighthawk> I don't think I had to make one last night?
<Nighthawk> who'd you add to yours?
<Joey> you, Mashi, Kaiveran.
<Joey> <Nighthawk> well I'm guessing someone beyond you and me decided to seer someone
<Nighthawk> Oh right, you said you were adding Mashi to your list.
<Joey> how do we know that, though?
<Nighthawk> I guess we don't.
<Joey> why did you bring that up, then?
<Nighthawk> Because I think it's likely that most people used a seering last night.
<Joey> That doesn't really make sense - you said you painted Jester red, then I said I painted you red, and then you called it a "third red seering".
<Nighthawk> No, I said I seered Jester red
<Nighthawk> I'm not a traitor
<Nighthawk> I can't paint people
<Nighthawk> So if you're telling the truth about me being red
<Nighthawk> that means that either one of me and jester was painted or we're both the red seers
<Nighthawk> I also think it's unlikely that either the wolves or traitors would have been painting anyone red last night
<Nighthawk> Because the traitors probably would have been saving their paintings for when they met up with the wolves (this only applies if Mashi's telling the truth about being a traitor)
<Joey> note: i meant to say "seered", sorry
<Joey> couldn't jester also be a wolf
<Nighthawk> He could be, but I think it's likely the wolves painted themselves blue.
<Nighthawk> (which is also why I'm trying this particular reaction test)
<Joey> why would they paint themselves blue on the first night, though?
<Joey> there's barely any suspicion
<Nighthawk> yeah, but I think they'd expect most human seers to use their seerings on night 1
<Joey> i know but what's a human seer going to do with a red result?
<Joey> i guess they could seer the same person later
<Joey> but that seems a bit more flimsy
<Joey> because then you'd have to get people to believe you actually seered them the first night
<Joey> and aren't just making it up to make them look suspicious
<Nighthawk> I was thinking we should publicly post all seerings from night 1
<Nighthawk> at least, that's what I'm planning on doing with my jester seering

That interrogation/reaction test started to turn into more of a strategical discussion since we both probably realized the other was probably not suspicious.

[Mivixion]

I haven't played in a while because after M4 I became really busy with stuff. The last game I played outside of here was in the end of July. I'll sign up for M14 probably, since I have more free time now.

Logs of an interrogation (important parts bolded, comments in red):

Spoiler: show

<Nighthawk> hey joey
<Nighthawk> what's up
<Joey> yo
<Nighthawk> what are you planning on doing about mashi (Mashi had recently claimed traitor in the game thread)
<Joey> not sure at this point.
<Joey> i thought about a group seering because some of them would be right
<Joey> but that was kind of a bad idea
<Nighthawk> what do you mean a "group seering"?
<Joey> i meant a lot of us seering him at once
<Joey> because the number of seerings > the number of possible paintings (this was a unique game, everyone was a seer and Mafia/traitors had painting powers)
<Nighthawk> yeah but doesn't it only take one seering?
<Nighthawk> sorry
<Nighthawk> i think one painting affects all seerings that phase
<Joey> oh wait a sec
<Joey> yeah you're right
<Joey> i'm not sure though
<Joey> that made a lot of sense in my head save for the fact that it'd waste seerings
<Joey> i also thought about adding mashi to my "people i trust" list and then seeing if i die when falling
<Nighthawk> the problem with that is if i'm a wolf
<Joey> then what
<Nighthawk> wait hm
<Nighthawk> if mashi's actually a traitor then you die
<Joey> yeah
<Nighthawk> the thing is that we don't really care if mashi lives to the end of the game
<Joey> lol
<Joey> i kinda wanted to use one of my powers tonight but i'm not sure who to use it on
<Nighthawk> If I use my power tonight I'm planning on using it on someone who I don't think others will use their powers on
<Joey> yeah
<Joey> i have to head out for a bit, i'll be back in a few hours probably
<Nighthawk> all right
<Nighthawk> i'll continue to think about this!
<Joey> sounds good

...

<Nighthawk> Hey Joey are you there?
<Joey> sup
<Nighthawk> I got some good news.
<Nighthawk> Last night
<Nighthawk> I asked sauce about painting mechanics
<Nighthawk> If both the wolves and the traitors paint a person, the color that person is seered is determined randomly
<Nighthawk> So I decided to paint and seer the same person in the hopes that the wolves would paint themselves blue and I might come into contact with one.
<Nighthawk> And it worked!
<Nighthawk> The other traitor's Jester, by the way.
<Nighthawk> Who's the second wolf?
<Joey> hmm
<Joey> are we sure about Mashi?
<Nighthawk> what do you mean are we sure about mashi?
<Nighthawk> like whether or not he's telling the truth?
<Joey> yeah
<Nighthawk> I'm a traitor, and my role PM says Jester's the other one.
<Joey> <Nighthawk> So I decided to paint and seer the same person in the hopes that the wolves would paint themselves blue and I might come into contact with one.
<Joey> who did you paint/seer
<Nighthawk> I'm saying I seered you blue but I painted you red.
<Joey> Oh.
<Joey> So that makes me...an orange seer? I'm missing something
<Nighthawk> no it means you painted yourself blue
<Joey> but i didn't
<Nighthawk> are you sure your partner didn't send in a late pm
<Joey> I don't have a partner
<Nighthawk> but then why were you seered blue when i painted you red?
<Joey> bcuz sauce is trippin
<Joey> I have no idea
<Nighthawk> hm
<Joey> I'm still fuzzy on how you came to that conclusion in the first place!!!
<Nighthawk> Basically I'm a traitor
<Nighthawk> and in order to look for wolves I'd seer the same person I painted red.
<Nighthawk> If they're any color other than red, it means that a wolf painted them that color.
<Nighthawk> I seered you blue.
<Nighthawk> So you must have been painted blue by a wolf
<Nighthawk> But a wolf would only paint themselves blue
<Nighthawk> so you must be a wolf.
<Joey> here's the thing though
<Joey> <Nighthawk> If they're any color other than red, it means that a wolf painted them that color.
<Joey> a wolf or a traitor.
<Joey> right?
<Nighthawk> yeah but I'm a traitor and I know the other traitor
<Joey> curveball though i seered you red last night, so who painted you? (I did actually seer him red)
<Nighthawk> and he tried the same thing on Damo
<Nighthawk> I have no idea.
<Joey> Hm.
<Joey> How much have you talked to Jester?
<Joey> Over the course of the whole game
<Nighthawk> Not a whole lot
<Nighthawk> you think he went rogue and painted you blue?
<Joey> wait
<Joey> <Nighthawk> If both the wolves and the traitors paint a person, the color that person is seered is determined randomly
<Joey> by "determined randomly"
<Nighthawk> Randomly between those two
<Joey> okay
<Joey> well someone must have, assuming you're telling me the truth, which i have not a lot of reason to believe since i seered you red
<Joey> and you being a red seer would go against your claim
<Nighthawk> maybe the wolves painted me red?
<Nighthawk> oh right you'd know if the wolves painted me red
<Joey> i would?
<Nighthawk> you are a wolf right
<Joey> ah, i see
<Joey> so what does this make Mashi?
<Nighthawk> a human i guess
<Joey> why would he claim traitor
<Nighthawk> there's a chance he's a wolf trying to look human but he certainly isn't the traitor.
<Nighthawk> To find wolves I guess
<Nighthawk> So who did you paint if you didn't paint me?
<Joey> I didn't paint anyone because I'm merely a seer
<Nighthawk> OK then, let's take a step back.
<Joey> alright
<Nighthawk> I lied about being a traitor.
* Joey sighs
<Joey> okay
<Nighthawk> Which also means I lied about seering you
<Nighthawk> and painting you
<Nighthawk> I actually seered Jester red.
<Nighthawk> I'm planning on trying this with a few more people.
<Joey> I still seered you red, for what it's worth.
<Nighthawk> Was I actually red though?
<Nighthawk> oh
<Joey> yeah
<Nighthawk> that's really interesting.
<Nighthawk> Because a third red seering means either the wolves didn't paint themselves blue tonight like I assumed they would
<Nighthawk> or they did and the traitors painted someone red.
<Joey> well, traitors painting someone red makes sense
<Joey> but there were 3 seerings?
<Joey> also, who did you add to your trust list, if you don't mind me asking? (trust lists were a game mechanic)
<Nighthawk> well I'm guessing someone beyond you and me decided to seer someone
<Nighthawk> I don't think I had to make one last night?
<Nighthawk> who'd you add to yours?
<Joey> you, Mashi, Kaiveran.
<Joey> <Nighthawk> well I'm guessing someone beyond you and me decided to seer someone
<Nighthawk> Oh right, you said you were adding Mashi to your list.
<Joey> how do we know that, though?
<Nighthawk> I guess we don't.
<Joey> why did you bring that up, then?
<Nighthawk> Because I think it's likely that most people used a seering last night.
<Joey> That doesn't really make sense - you said you painted Jester red, then I said I painted you red, and then you called it a "third red seering".
<Nighthawk> No, I said I seered Jester red
<Nighthawk> I'm not a traitor
<Nighthawk> I can't paint people
<Nighthawk> So if you're telling the truth about me being red
<Nighthawk> that means that either one of me and jester was painted or we're both the red seers
<Nighthawk> I also think it's unlikely that either the wolves or traitors would have been painting anyone red last night
<Nighthawk> Because the traitors probably would have been saving their paintings for when they met up with the wolves (this only applies if Mashi's telling the truth about being a traitor)
<Joey> note: i meant to say "seered", sorry
<Joey> couldn't jester also be a wolf
<Nighthawk> He could be, but I think it's likely the wolves painted themselves blue.
<Nighthawk> (which is also why I'm trying this particular reaction test)
<Joey> why would they paint themselves blue on the first night, though?
<Joey> there's barely any suspicion
<Nighthawk> yeah, but I think they'd expect most human seers to use their seerings on night 1
<Joey> i know but what's a human seer going to do with a red result?
<Joey> i guess they could seer the same person later
<Joey> but that seems a bit more flimsy
<Joey> because then you'd have to get people to believe you actually seered them the first night
<Joey> and aren't just making it up to make them look suspicious
<Nighthawk> I was thinking we should publicly post all seerings from night 1
<Nighthawk> at least, that's what I'm planning on doing with my jester seering

That interrogation/reaction test started to turn into more of a strategical discussion since we both probably realized the other was probably not suspicious.

I can see how the circumstances affect the interrogation and even the game significantly.

[Danny]

So I'd like to point out that in the current M13 game (Zeldamaster12's), the Town has little, little chance at winning as is right now. The Town has no form of Vigilante role, and it mainly relies on the Sheriff role to lead them through the game. If the Sheriff is dead, the Town has little chance at actually succeeding, seeing as they must lynch in the day (especially when nobody has had a lead at all), and they face two deaths every single night from the serial killer and mafia.

Given the chances of the Serial Killer actually killing a Mafia instead of a Townie, and seeing as the Mafia doesn't have the risk of killing one of their own, the Town is doomed unless the Mafia strikes lucky and kills the Serial Killer, giving the Town some breathing space. At this point, not a lot of people trust anyone, and there is a blue dead, with the 1 in 4 chance that it could possibly be the Sheriff, and if that's the case then the Town is screwed over. And if nobody trusts anybody, the Sheriff won't get to tell anyone the colors of the people they inspected, which puts the Town at greater risk.

All in all, I don't think, unless the Town gets extremely lucky, that they can possibly win this game, it just wasn't balanced evenly at all given that the town faces two deaths every night and the only way they can kill a SINGLE player off is through lynching, and even then not everyone can agree to that. I'm not a fan of this one to be honest.

[DatDude]

So I'd like to point out that in the current M13 game (Zeldamaster12's), the Town has little, little chance at winning as is right now. The Town has no form of Vigilante role...

There IS a Vigilante, which is played by Midna. As I would re-quote it...

Midna: The Princess of the Twilight Realm. She has the ability to send a player to the Twilight Realm, disallowing them from ever returning to the regular world (killing basically). If she kills a Hero, then she won't be able to use her ability for a night.

[Danny]

So I'd like to point out that in the current M13 game (Zeldamaster12's), the Town has little, little chance at winning as is right now. The Town has no form of Vigilante role...

There IS a Vigilante, which is played by Midna. As I would re-quote it...

Midna: The Princess of the Twilight Realm. She has the ability to send a player to the Twilight Realm, disallowing them from ever returning to the regular world (killing basically). If she kills a Hero, then she won't be able to use her ability for a night.

From what I understood it was that the player targeted by Midna was basically turned to stone for the night. That changes things, but there have only been 2 night kills and a day kill, so that may or may not have been Midna. If Midna is dead then we're screwed even more.

Sorry for the misunderstanding.

[underFlo]

[17:23:41] <Layla> ok first off, just to know I'm not trying to play a dirty trick here
[17:23:44] <Layla> I'm a mafia
[17:23:46] <Layla> and I don't want to be
[17:23:59] <Layla> my other two don't know I'm not really trying to help them at all
[17:24:11] <Layla> I'm actually trying to help 8bit get rid of sk
[17:25:32] <Mystogan> yeah
[17:25:48] <Mystogan> but what's zlaker did he tell you?
[17:26:32] <Layla> he just said townie
[17:26:38] <Mystogan> meh
[17:26:43] <Mystogan> i want your role if any
[17:26:46] <Layla> something tells me he's Link
[17:26:50] <Layla> Mystogan: don't bother
[17:26:54] <Mystogan> why
[17:26:56] <Layla> I already used my role anyays
[17:27:01] <Mystogan> which is what

If these quotes are true, that's effectively gamethrow of Layla and should be punished. He decided to work against his own fraction because he doesn't want to be Mafia, which is a bullshit reason. The goal of Mafia is to make the best out of whichever role you've got. You're mafia but don't want to? Well, bad news, you still have to cooperate with the mafia. Purposely teaming up with the town is the worst a Mafia member can do.

[TLtimelord]

[17:23:41] <Layla> ok first off, just to know I'm not trying to play a dirty trick here
[17:23:44] <Layla> I'm a mafia
[17:23:46] <Layla> and I don't want to be
[17:23:59] <Layla> my other two don't know I'm not really trying to help them at all
[17:24:11] <Layla> I'm actually trying to help 8bit get rid of sk
[17:25:32] <Mystogan> yeah
[17:25:48] <Mystogan> but what's zlaker did he tell you?
[17:26:32] <Layla> he just said townie
[17:26:38] <Mystogan> meh
[17:26:43] <Mystogan> i want your role if any
[17:26:46] <Layla> something tells me he's Link
[17:26:50] <Layla> Mystogan: don't bother
[17:26:54] <Mystogan> why
[17:26:56] <Layla> I already used my role anyays
[17:27:01] <Mystogan> which is what

If these quotes are true, that's effectively gamethrow of Layla and should be punished. He decided to work against his own fraction because he doesn't want to be Mafia, which is a bullshit reason. The goal of Mafia is to make the best out of whichever role you've got. You're mafia but don't want to? Well, bad news, you still have to cooperate with the mafia. Purposely teaming up with the town is the worst a Mafia member can do.

The issue is here is I never actually did anything to hurt my fellow mafia team other than lying about trying to recruit the SK.

EDIT:

also:
[17:23:59] <Layla> my other two don't know I'm not really trying to help them at all

That was quite the overstatement on my part. I never actually did anything against my teammates other than lie that I would attempt to find and recruit the SK, which I decided to do the polar opposite by teaming up with 8bit to get rid of the SK.

[underFlo]

I'll do you guys one better. I just sent a pm to zeldamaster asking to suicide.

so whether i die or not is up to him. toodles.

The salt is real

Also TNT, I still think this wasn't optimal play of you, but I'm not one to decide.

Edit:

also appearently im stupid now because im trusting a person based on role? I guess you've never heard of a traitor. hum, so tnt is a traitor to the mafia since he didnt want to be mafia. hmmm.... and he wants to help 8bit kill the sk.... hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.... so does this make 8bit stupid too?

This "traitor" would be breaking the rules though, and thus resulting in gamethrow. It would be way more likwly that he's fucking with you then purposely breaking the rules.

I remember once being in a reverse-Mafia (there are less townies then mafias but thw mafias don't know eah other and the town had a cult) where we culted someone and he was purposely playing agaisnt the town. He got subbed and punished.
No matter how pissed you are with your role, you should make the most of it.
This game pretty much shows how useless you pretty much are without a power role to back you up.

[HeroOfRhyme]

I love you Nickname


the way you play the game is so...what's the word for it...so.."like you" I suppose?

i guess from what i heard the mafia are just killing people they find annoying lol. So i guess you're annoying.

[underFlo]

I love you Nickname


the way you play the game is so...what's the word for it...so.."like you" I suppose?

i guess from what i heard the mafia are just killing people they find annoying lol. So i guess you're annoying.

Mafia kills people that are good players. So I guess I'm a good player?

[HeroOfRhyme]

no, you'res very annoying lol

if your theory is any good then how is qig alive

[underFlo]

no, you'res very annoying lol

if your theory is any good then how is qig alive

Mind Games to make us believe qig is mafia, or maybe he is?

I've never actually heard that the Mafia kills annoying players. They either choose random on N1 or choose players that help the town.

Also, I don't think you and your salt are any less annoying then me. At least I don't always accuse people withiut evidence or trust ppl bc they are my friends.

In Mafia, evidence is everything. If you can't back up your claims, you're suspicious.

Being salty doesn't help either.

[HeroOfRhyme]

yeah but im trying to be annoying on purpose.

and i dont always accuse people without evidence, or were you not playing M12, like that game after M11 in which I practically won both games?

[underFlo]

yeah but im trying to be annoying on purpose.

and i dont always accuse people without evidence, or were you not playing M12, like that game after M11 in which I practically won both games?

Your play style is incredibly risky (if the one you blindly believe lies to you the town is pretty mich fucked) and you get so incredibly full of yourself after every win.

Also being annoying on purpose isn't any better.

[MistakesWereMade]

yeah but im trying to be annoying on purpose.

and i dont always accuse people without evidence, or were you not playing M12, like that game after M11 in which I practically won both games?

theres no such thing as evidence in mafia lmao

[HeroOfRhyme]

yeah but im trying to be annoying on purpose.

and i dont always accuse people without evidence, or were you not playing M12, like that game after M11 in which I practically won both games?

theres no such thing as evidence in mafia lmao

lmao basically, not here at least.