RETRO Boss Contest! [RESULTS AND MEDALS!!!]

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Darkonius Mavakar
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RETRO Boss Contest! [RESULTS AND MEDALS!!!]

Postby Darkonius Mavakar » Thu Feb 23, 2023 3:54 pm

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Greetings, I am a boss fight fanatic, I always enjoy when a level has a boss fight and doubly so if it is well designed and engaging.

Back in around the 2014-smbx era we didn't have Lunalua and so I used to make bosses by using ye olde layers and events and of course custom graphics and the like.

Now there's a question that's been on my mind, how would the community nowadays design a boss without Lua?
Certainly, there's still people that make bosses Lua-less, but regardless I'd love to see what more Lua-versed people would reverse-engineer SMBX to try and make a new boss WITHOUT lua as well!

So... ahem.
[Pre-results breakdown of the contest in this spoiler]
Spoiler: show
THE RULES
- You cannot use another custom/user-made code. That means no custom libraries, luna.lua, custom NPCs/blocks, etc.
- Grafs/crates and other NPCs that technically run lua are allowed, but you cannot exploit this and may only use them to affect their position/settings.
-You can use basegame features that involve lua pre-installed (Such as the new X2 enemies)
-Configs (NPCs, BGOs, Particles, etc.) Are limited to what is usable via txt/ini files. Anything that is only accessible via lua is banned.
-NO NPC PACKS
-You CAN use custom graphics & music!
-You must NOT make a level, you are only required to make one boss.
-Only ONE submission is allowed.
-You can team up with some friends to design a boss if you'd like!
-Your level MUST end with either a ? Ball or a SMB3 star


WHEN'S THE DEADLINE MY DUDE?

30th of March 2023!

WHERE DO I SUBMIT MY ENTRY???
Spoiler: show
send the links via pidgeon bird thanks
Simple!
Just PM me over the forums, simple as that!
Submissions will be accepted if they are sent via Google Drive OR Dropbox... or literally anything else unless it's Mediafire, please no Mediafire.
THE SCORING SYSTEM???
Spoiler: show
You will get a score from 0 to 100 divided in these categories:
-Creativity 40 [How well have you managed to use SMBX's vanilla mechanics to make a boss?]
-Fun 40 [Was it fun to fight the boss? Is it engaging?]
-Visuals 20 [Of course you can score high with this if you use 100% vanilla graphics, you just gotta make your fight look interesting and thematic/fitting!]

SO WHO JUDGES THESE THINGS ANYWAYS?
Spoiler: show
ME.
Well... Sort of, currently it is only me, but if someone offers to join the judging ranks and proves that they fit in, I might consider adding them to the roster-- keep in mind i might also just ask people i trust.
GOT ANY TIPS, LAD?
Spoiler: show
Yes!
-Study vanilla enemy AI, their movement patterns, projectile shooting and the like can prove excellent help for making your vanilla layer-and-event fights more engaging!
-Attach to layer can be your friend, so why not experiment with it a bit?
-If you want a video reference of what you can accomplish with vanilla layers and events, check out the bosses in Delightful Adventure [2014 original, video is timestamped to the non-lua part] https://youtu.be/A4iPqI4Pfu0?t=1474
-You can also join our general-use official SMBX contest discord! https://discord.gg/SEgsHJhCa4
Got any questions? use this thread!
RESULTS!!!
Spoiler: show
1 - Ness-Wednesday | Scott out of Hell | 95/100
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2 - Cold Soup | Mecha Mario | 89/100
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3 - Cloud Devil | Mega Mole Tank | 84/100
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4 - Deice | Double Scarlet | 61/100
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5 - Chromanyan | Queen Rinka's Revenge | 41/100
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6 - Lunar Chris | Flaming Reznor | 17/100
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7 - Lichh | HELIBOSS | 9/100
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8 - Amattson | Cosmic Eye Watcher | 8/100
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You can read about the individual scores and reviews in this link right here!
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

DOWNLOAD THE ENTRIES HERE:
viewtopic.php?t=28971
Last edited by Darkonius Mavakar on Sat Apr 08, 2023 1:02 pm, edited 9 times in total.

DRACalgar Law
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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby DRACalgar Law » Thu Feb 23, 2023 5:42 pm

If you say do not use lua, do you mean no using Blocks, NPCs, and BGOs from SMBX2?

Darkonius Mavakar
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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby Darkonius Mavakar » Thu Feb 23, 2023 6:27 pm

DRACalgar Law wrote:
Thu Feb 23, 2023 5:42 pm
If you say do not use lua, do you mean no using Blocks, NPCs, and BGOs from SMBX2?

You can use all features of SMBX2 as long as you do not use lua libraries and coding itself

Yes you can use rain effects, or dino rhinos and so on

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby cold soup » Thu Feb 23, 2023 7:10 pm

is sounds.ini allowed?

Darkonius Mavakar
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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby Darkonius Mavakar » Thu Feb 23, 2023 7:21 pm

Yes.
Also i have updated the rules because i forgot to mention that your boss has to end with a ? Sphere or a smb3 star

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby deice » Thu Feb 23, 2023 7:31 pm

where do grafs/eeries/crates etc. fit into all this? i know that using them to execute arbitrary lua code is obviously not allowed, i just wanna know at what point it crosses that line.

for example, is using the custom settings on a graf or eerie to make a projectile that tracks the player disallowed?

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby ChromaNyan » Thu Feb 23, 2023 7:46 pm

are joke submissions allowed provided they follow the rules

also, can bosses have checkpoints between their phases

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby Emral » Thu Feb 23, 2023 8:31 pm

How do NPC packs factor into the rules?

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby MarioChallengerX2 » Thu Feb 23, 2023 9:07 pm

1. Is modifying npc.n.txt allowed? (n being the ID of the NPC) (At the very least, can we use it to modify hitpoints of certain npcs) It's an option in PGE called New NPC configuration.
2. Also, in Super Mario 3D World, the final boss is like....a moving boss. Like, you're not fighting the boss, the boss is trying to hit you while you progress a la autoscroll. (Yes, I know we can't use autoscroll.lua but I think the base game's autoscroll should be fine.)
Emral wrote:
Thu Feb 23, 2023 8:31 pm
How do NPC packs factor into the rules?
3. And to quote Emral, I have a feeling that almost any NPC that has sort of lua in them will not be viable. (which most custom npcs like....Amped Jewels, Tesla Coils, and possibly Flamethrowers from Redstone pack) But what about modifications of basegame NPCS?
Like.....Megadood's Invincible Chucks in his NPC Pack?
4. Can bosses be notably difficult? Like, if I were to make a Kaizo Style Boss or something that requires really hard tricks? (which btw, if Jedat enters in this contest, he might ask the same thing lol)

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby Darkonius Mavakar » Fri Feb 24, 2023 4:55 am

So clearly there's a lot of technicalities and specifics in the sentence "don't use lua" that i should've probably foreseen and specified before posting the thread, so i'll be using this to answer a buncha questions and then update the rules to be more specific as well.
deice wrote:
Thu Feb 23, 2023 7:31 pm
where do grafs/eeries/crates etc. fit into all this? i know that using them to execute arbitrary lua code is obviously not allowed, i just wanna know at what point it crosses that line.

for example, is using the custom settings on a graf or eerie to make a projectile that tracks the player disallowed?
You can use all features of a graf unless you're using them to be cheeky and run abritrary lua codes and the like.
ChromaNyan wrote:
Thu Feb 23, 2023 7:46 pm
are joke submissions allowed provided they follow the rules

also, can bosses have checkpoints between their phases
1- yes
2- also yes
Emral wrote:
Thu Feb 23, 2023 8:31 pm
How do NPC packs factor into the rules?
NPC packs are not allowed, the point of this contest is to use what the default x2 editor gives you in terms of enemies and blocks, so anything that's not present in the default editor is not allowed.
MarioChallengerX2 wrote:
Thu Feb 23, 2023 9:07 pm
1. Is modifying npc.n.txt allowed? (n being the ID of the NPC) (At the very least, can we use it to modify hitpoints of certain npcs) It's an option in PGE called New NPC configuration.
2. Also, in Super Mario 3D World, the final boss is like....a moving boss. Like, you're not fighting the boss, the boss is trying to hit you while you progress a la autoscroll. (Yes, I know we can't use autoscroll.lua but I think the base game's autoscroll should be fine.)
Emral wrote:
Thu Feb 23, 2023 8:31 pm
How do NPC packs factor into the rules?
3. And to quote Emral, I have a feeling that almost any NPC that has sort of lua in them will not be viable. (which most custom npcs like....Amped Jewels, Tesla Coils, and possibly Flamethrowers from Redstone pack) But what about modifications of basegame NPCS?
Like.....Megadood's Invincible Chucks in his NPC Pack?
4. Can bosses be notably difficult? Like, if I were to make a Kaizo Style Boss or something that requires really hard tricks? (which btw, if Jedat enters in this contest, he might ask the same thing lol)
1- Yes, you can use npc.txt and the like, as long as you don't somehow run arbitrary code and the like.
2- Yes you can use autoscroll (as long as you don't use the LUA autoscroll feature)
3- NPC packs are not available, basegame npcs modifications via npc packs are not allowed either, you must use what you're given by the editor, but you are allowed to edit their npc.txt and the like as long as you're using the values present in the wiki (example, Panser's volley number and so on and the classic changes like playeblocktop and the like)
4- you can make the boss as difficult as you want, just know that kaizo is always a finnicky cup of tea



ESSENTIALLY: NO EXTERNAL LUA CODES OR ABRITRARY CODE EXECUTION, USE WHAT DEFAULT X2 NPCS & BLOCKS ARE PROVIDED, THE MOMENT YOUR LEVEL HAS A SINGLE .LUA FILE WITHIN YOUR FOLDER THEN THAT'S NOT ALLOWED, you CAN use custom graphics
literally make a boss as if it's 2014 like the video example i provided

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest! Make a boss like it was 2014!

Postby Emral » Fri Feb 24, 2023 6:42 am

Now I know you said that any lua files are forbidden, but you might not have considered this edge case so I wanna bring it up: There are some NPC Config values (vulnerableharmtypes and the likes) that are not editable via txt, but only by typing that line in lua, because there is no parser for table values in NPC config. Are those allowed?

Darkonius Mavakar
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Re: RETRO Boss Contest! Make a boss like it was 2014!

Postby Darkonius Mavakar » Fri Feb 24, 2023 7:58 am

Emral wrote:
Fri Feb 24, 2023 6:42 am
Now I know you said that any lua files are forbidden, but you might not have considered this edge case so I wanna bring it up: There are some NPC Config values (vulnerableharmtypes and the likes) that are not editable via txt, but only by typing that line in lua, because there is no parser for table values in NPC config. Are those allowed?
No, those are not allowed at least this time around, I want to see what people can do with the bare basics first if I plan to open a new contest similar to this in the future then yes

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest! Make a boss like it was 2014!

Postby MarioChallengerX2 » Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:33 am

Okay, now I know more but there is one more thing I need to ask. Here's a bug in base SMBX2 without any Lunalua.

If you make a Bowser Statue Appear on a layer that it was invisible on.

i.e: if a grey bowser statue was on a layer called sp1 and that layer was hidden and then you trigger an event that makes the layer appear like stomping on a goomba.

When the Bowser Statue fires its projectile, it consistently crashes the game.

This was an issue in my SciCon Snake Block Level and the only way to fix it was a lua script provided by KBM Quine.

And the Bowser Statue is a prevalent projectile firer in my opinion. (if there's one similar to this, then maybe it won't be necessary.

So, my question is. Can we use Lua in order to fixing unavoidable bugs in NPCs that crash the game?

EDIT: I should ask one more time if we are discouraged to custom graphics or the sort? (I ask because along the lines of you'll surely score 100% if you use vanilla graphics.

Darkonius Mavakar
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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby Darkonius Mavakar » Fri Feb 24, 2023 12:51 pm

Updated the rules once again to make them clearer and update them a bit, apologies for the rapid adjustments.

And as for your questions, MarioChallenger:

1- no, you cannot, you will have to find another way
2- you are not discouraged from using custom graphics, you can use as many as you want or any at all

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest! Make a boss like it was 2014!

Postby TLtimelord » Sat Feb 25, 2023 4:01 am

Emral wrote:
Fri Feb 24, 2023 6:42 am
Now I know you said that any lua files are forbidden, but you might not have considered this edge case so I wanna bring it up: There are some NPC Config values (vulnerableharmtypes and the likes) that are not editable via txt, but only by typing that line in lua, because there is no parser for table values in NPC config. Are those allowed?
Look it's like, if you need a luna.lua file to do it, you can't do it. Imagine it's 2012 1.3 smbx, but you have some more in-editor features to work with. That's the intention of this contest. Re-live the 'fun' workarounds with NPC reskins and layers & events, luna.dll or luna.lua are inconceivable fantasies in the far future.

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby Darkonius Mavakar » Tue Mar 07, 2023 5:57 am

One person has already submitted their entry!
Excited to see more as time goes along!

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby Darkonius Mavakar » Sun Mar 26, 2023 5:23 am

Just about 4 days left till submissions close!!!

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby deice » Sun Mar 26, 2023 7:53 am

quick question, are we allowed to share creations publicly before submitting them? don't see the rules specifying otherwise so i assume yes but i'm just makin' sure

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest!

Postby Darkonius Mavakar » Sun Mar 26, 2023 1:22 pm

deice wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 7:53 am
quick question, are we allowed to share creations publicly before submitting them? don't see the rules specifying otherwise so i assume yes but i'm just makin' sure
yes you can share publicly

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Re: RETRO Boss Contest! [SUBMISSION CLOSED]

Postby Darkonius Mavakar » Thu Mar 30, 2023 4:46 am

SUBMISSIONS ARE NOW CLOSED!

It'll take a bit for me to judge all the entries but of course i'll let you know news ASAP!


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